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  1. #1
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    Default USSR in World War II: how West belittles its role

    Falsification of the history of events and the results of World War II has always been an essential feature of modern Western military historiography and propaganda. After the war ended, its events were repeatedly subjected to these falsifications by both political leaders of the West and many historians. Supporters of the idea of the Cold War diligently appealed to the leading role of the United States during the war. The period from 1939 to 1945 was particularly intensively falsified after the collapse of the USSR when Western culture and values penetrated the territory of the former socialist camp. The main problem to this day has been that the role of the United States in World War II has been actively implanted in the minds of young people and in the light in which the USSR is exposed today as one of the actors of this large-scale war in the history of mankind. Recent events have demonstrated how the West is once again trying to downplay the role of the USSR. On July 23, 2019 Poland did not invite Russia to celebrate the 80th anniversary of the outbreak of World War II, but at the same time called Germany. Probably, the fact that it was Germany that attacked Poland on September 1, 1939 did not bother the country's governance.
    Another important factor is how the essence of the Second World War is presented to students in American schools, where it is argued that the victory in Europe was won by the States, and the Second World War began on December 7, 1941 after the Japanese attacked the American naval base Pearl-Harbor, after which there was a slight confrontation in Italy and North Africa, and then the war actually began on June 6, 1944 after landing in Normandy. As a result of bloody battles, American troops landed on the west coast of France, reached Berlin and declared their victory in the Second World War. Moreover, the role of the USSR is hardly mentioned in American historical literature. According to a survey conducted by the British agency ICM Research in April 2015 among European citizens, 52% of respondents said that it was the United States that played a key role in the victory over fascism in Europe and only 17% said that it was the Soviet Union. It is noteworthy that the study conducted by the IFOP agency immediately after the end of the Second World War reflected a completely different situation. 57% of the inhabitants of France stated that the Soviet Union played the main role in defeating Hitler, 20% said it was the USA and 12% - Great Britain. All this speaks of how the West purposefully makes not only its citizens, but also the citizens of Western Europe consider the USSR as an almost mediocre actor during the war, which played a secondary role in deciding the fate of Europe.
    Naturally, the role of the allies during the Second World War should not be ruled out. Thanks to Lend-Lease, the Soviet Union was equipped with additional equipment, which slightly, but eased the economic situation of the state. Western authoritative historians consider Lend-Lease as "saving" for the Soviet Union. However, the same historians are silent about the fact that the amount of aid under the Lend-Lease of the USSR was quite small - only about 4% of the funds spent by the country on the war, and the tanks and aircraft supplied to the USSR were mainly outdated models. In addition, the bulk of this assistance came at a time when the USSR had already launched a counterattack. It is safe to say that Lend-Lease didn't play a decisive role during the war, and neither the governance of Western states, nor Western non-governmental organizations will ever recognize this fact. Without Lend-Lease, the Soviet Union would have ended the war not by May 1945, but, for example, by 1946.
    Lately, there appear declassified documents related to the Second World War. It is necessary in order to preserve historical authenticity. On September 9, 2019, the Ministry of Defense of the Russian Federation declassified documents that reveal previously unknown details of world military policy on the eve of the war. Among the published materials there is a description of the combat operations of the 2nd German Army Corps during the offensive on Poland in 1939. The testimony of the German general demonstrates the fierce resistance of the Poles, the intense course of the battles for Warsaw and the Modlin fortress is also described. The documents of the Ministry of Defense also talk about how the inhabitants of Western Ukraine with flowers in their hands and with tears in their eyes met the Soviet troops, who liberated them during the Polish campaign from oppression by the Poles and invaders.
    Thus, whatever the political motives of the governance of Western countries to denigrate and belittle the role and importance of the USSR in World War II were, European citizens themselves must realize what kind of burden their relatives had to carry, whose lands were occupied by German Nazis. A knowledge of the methods of falsifiers, as well as a demonstration of their anti-science should be an important condition for a reasoned fight against distortion and juggling the history of the Second World War. And only by opening the archives and making available to researchers and the common man the whole set of documents of that period (this applies not only to Russia, but also to other countries), it is possible to objectively and impartially display the true causes of the war, its course and results.

  2. #2
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    More one-post propaganda.

    The materials provided in Lend-Lease were hardly 'outdated' as described above. They were
    up-to-date aircraft and tanks of the time. They were eventually replaced by newer platforms.
    I have lost my mind. If found, please give it a snack and return it?

    "I won't be wronged. I won't be insulted. I won't be laid a hand on. I don't do these things to other people, and I require the same of others"...John Wayne in "The Shootist"

    A Deplorable!

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  4. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by Elessar View Post
    More one-post propaganda.

    The materials provided in Lend-Lease were hardly 'outdated' as described above. They were
    up-to-date aircraft and tanks of the time. They were eventually replaced by newer platforms.
    I'm sure everyone here is aware of the USSR having the heaviest casualties. What those like this new wittle poster forget is that the reason they had was because Stalin wanted to grab Poland and as much of Eastern Europe as possible. He made a 'deal' with Hitler. It cost his people.

    Then there were the purges of the upper echelon of the Soviet military, because if one is Stalin, you have to take out anyone who might turn against you. Again, there was a huge cost.


    "The government is a child that has found their parents credit card, and spends knowing that they never have to reconcile the bill with their own money"-Shannon Churchill


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    Quote Originally Posted by Kathianne View Post
    I'm sure everyone here is aware of the USSR having the heaviest casualties. What those like this new wittle poster forget is that the reason they had was because Stalin wanted to grab Poland and as much of Eastern Europe as possible. He made a 'deal' with Hitler. It cost his people.

    Then there were the purges of the upper echelon of the Soviet military, because if one is Stalin, you have to take out anyone who might turn against you. Again, there was a huge cost.
    'Remarkable', isn't it, that the 'little' detail of Stalin's preference to count Hitler as his conquest ally / buddy, is so 'easily forgotten'. Indeed, I understand it was Hitler who broke that pact with Stalin, not Stalin himself.

    Do the massive numbers of war-dead suffered by Russia, at Hitler's hands, merit sympathy ? 'Yes', to be sure ... but let's not forget that the PREFERRED allegiance of Stalin's, was with Hitler. Had Hitler not proven treacherous ... would those who died have instead served (even if indirectly) the cause of the Nazi Third Reich ?
    It's That Bloody Foreigner Again !!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kathianne View Post
    I'm sure everyone here is aware of the USSR having the heaviest casualties. What those like this new wittle poster forget is that the reason they had was because Stalin wanted to grab Poland and as much of Eastern Europe as possible. He made a 'deal' with Hitler. It cost his people.

    Then there were the purges of the upper echelon of the Soviet military, because if one is Stalin, you have to take out anyone who might turn against you. Again, there was a huge cost.
    Stalin removed or murdered 2/3rds of his field commanders early in the war, leaving
    mostly inexperienced officers to take over.

    Yes, he was allied with Hitler early on, but Hitler turned on him.
    I have lost my mind. If found, please give it a snack and return it?

    "I won't be wronged. I won't be insulted. I won't be laid a hand on. I don't do these things to other people, and I require the same of others"...John Wayne in "The Shootist"

    A Deplorable!

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  10. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by Drummond View Post
    'Remarkable', isn't it, that the 'little' detail of Stalin's preference to count Hitler as his conquest ally / buddy, is so 'easily forgotten'. Indeed, I understand it was Hitler who broke that pact with Stalin, not Stalin himself.

    Do the massive numbers of war-dead suffered by Russia, at Hitler's hands, merit sympathy ? 'Yes', to be sure ... but let's not forget that the PREFERRED allegiance of Stalin's, was with Hitler. Had Hitler not proven treacherous ... would those who died have instead served (even if indirectly) the cause of the Nazi Third Reich ?
    This was one of the times, there were others, when FDR should have listened to Churchill.


    "The government is a child that has found their parents credit card, and spends knowing that they never have to reconcile the bill with their own money"-Shannon Churchill


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  12. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Elessar View Post
    Stalin removed or murdered 2/3rds of his field commanders early in the war, leaving
    mostly inexperienced officers to take over.

    Yes, he was allied with Hitler early on, but Hitler turned on him.
    Stalin was never allied with Hitler. The two nations had a non aggression pact , that Hitler obviously never intended to honor; but the two were never allies.

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    Quote Originally Posted by STTAB View Post
    Stalin was never allied with Hitler. The two nations had a non aggression pact , that Hitler obviously never intended to honor; but the two were never allies.
    It has been argued that if Stalin never agreed to said pact, WWII may well have not been a World War. There are good arguments of that. Truth is, we never should have allied with Stalin. Churchill was right.


    "The government is a child that has found their parents credit card, and spends knowing that they never have to reconcile the bill with their own money"-Shannon Churchill


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    Quote Originally Posted by Kathianne View Post
    It has been argued that if Stalin never agreed to said pact, WWII may well have not been a World War. There are good arguments of that. Truth is, we never should have allied with Stalin. Churchill was right.
    If we hadn't allied with Stalin in Europe, we would have most likely had to have dropped an A bomb on Germany to end the war. An A bomb that frankly we didn't have to spare. It probably would have by most accounts taken another year to build a third bomb.

    Allying with the Soviet Union wasn't the mistake, giving them control of part of Europe after the war was the mistake.

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    While most of the OP was amusing with the half-truths and distortions, this little gem got an outright LOL from me :

    Quote Originally Posted by MostFamous
    The documents of the Ministry of Defense also talk about how the inhabitants of Western Ukraine with flowers in their hands and with tears in their eyes met the Soviet troops, who liberated them during the Polish campaign from oppression by the Poles and invaders.


    Yes, those bloodthirsty Poles were pretty much responsible for all the shenanigans flying around Europe & Asia. I'd forgotten all about that. Didn't Poland make it almost to Siberia before they were repelled by the heroic Soviets?

    I think Poland should apologize for their role in the war. Probably should pay reparations, too.
    Interdum feror cupidine partium magnarum Europae vincendarum

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  18. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by STTAB View Post
    If we hadn't allied with Stalin in Europe, we would have most likely had to have dropped an A bomb on Germany to end the war. An A bomb that frankly we didn't have to spare. It probably would have by most accounts taken another year to build a third bomb.

    Allying with the Soviet Union wasn't the mistake, giving them control of part of Europe after the war was the mistake.
    Perhaps. Then again, Poland and other eastern holdings might have been able to have helped.

    I don't have time for 'what if,' but have always wondered if so much would have been different.


    "The government is a child that has found their parents credit card, and spends knowing that they never have to reconcile the bill with their own money"-Shannon Churchill


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    Quote Originally Posted by STTAB View Post
    Allying with the Soviet Union wasn't the mistake, giving them control of part of Europe after the war was the mistake.

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    Quote Originally Posted by NightTrain View Post
    While most of the OP was amusing with the half-truths and distortions, this little gem got an outright LOL from me :



    Yes, those bloodthirsty Poles were pretty much responsible for all the shenanigans flying around Europe & Asia. I'd forgotten all about that. Didn't Poland make it almost to Siberia before they were repelled by the heroic Soviets?

    I think Poland should apologize for their role in the war. Probably should pay reparations, too.[/COLOR]

    Just as a matter of historical record Germany invaded Poland first and when the Soviets followed suit there WERE Poles who were happy to see the Soviets show up. They stupidly believed the Soviets were there to deliver them from the Germans, not to annex them for themselves.

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  22. #14
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    I'm aware.

    Ivan believes that the Soviets rescued Ukrainians from occupying Pollocks. Somehow.

    If any country is blameless in the run up and ensuing shenanigans, it would be Poland. They got a pretty raw deal from both sides.
    Interdum feror cupidine partium magnarum Europae vincendarum

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    Quote Originally Posted by NightTrain View Post
    I'm aware.

    Ivan believes that the Soviets rescued Ukrainians from occupying Pollocks. Somehow.

    If any country is blameless in the run up and ensuing shenanigans, it would be Poland. They got a pretty raw deal from both sides.
    and the Czechs.


    "The government is a child that has found their parents credit card, and spends knowing that they never have to reconcile the bill with their own money"-Shannon Churchill


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