Another simple question for Jafar!!!

[Nukeman]

Here is another "SIMPLE" question for Jafar. Since in another thread it was posed that we should just ask straight simple questions.

Why do Islamic countries condone the FORCED CONVERSION of Christians to the Islamic faith, also why is that if ONE parent converts to Islam any susequent children must convert to Islam.

I also have not seen your answer to Jimmy about apostasy.

In Islam, apostasy is called "ridda" ("turning back") and it is considered by Muslims to be a profound insult to God. A person born of Muslim parents that rejects Islam is called a "murtad fitri" (natural apostate), and a person that converted to Islam and later rejects the religion is called a "murtad milli" (apostate from the community).

The question of the penalties imposed in Islam (i.e. in the Qur'an or under shariah law) for apostasy is a highly controversial topic that is passionately debated by various scholars. On this basis, according to most scholars, if a Muslim consciously and without coercion declares their rejection of Islam and does not change their mind after the time given to him/her by a judge for research, then the penalty for male apostates is the death penalty, or, for women, life imprisonment. However, this view has been rejected by an extremely small minority of modern Muslim scholars I like the small minority(eg Hasan al-Turabi), who argues that the hadith in question should be taken to apply only to political betrayal of the Muslim community, rather than to apostasy in general.[

These are very simple questions about a faith you profess to follow. I also dont want your patent answer that "tese people aren't real Muslims" That my friend is a crock af shit and you know it. If they aren't true Muslims than why do sooo many follow these paths????

Here's one link.

http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/ar...TICLE_ID=57530

Headlines this week reported that Migsti Haile, a 33-year-old Christian woman, was tortured to death in Eritrea for refusing to recant her faith, and the European Center for Law and Justice is asking the United Nations to address what it described as the growing problem of forced religious conversions around the world.

"We had been getting notification from lawyers and human rights groups that this issue was growing, and we thought it was high time that the United Nations address it," Jay Sekulow, chief counsel for the ECLJ as well as the organization's U.S. affiliate, the American Center for Law and Justice, told WND.

He said the problem is not necessarily always national governments, but local governments and area factions, which are "putting pressure" on people and "threatening people with up to death if they don't renounce their conversion to Christianity."

[jafar00]

Here is another "SIMPLE" question for Jafar. Since in another thread it was posed that we should just ask straight simple questions.

Why do Islamic countries condone the FORCED CONVERSION of Christians to the Islamic faith,

Forced conversion is something that is not allowed nor encouraged in Islam.

There is no compulsion in religion 2:256

And say to My servants (that) they speak that which is best; surely the Shaitan sows dissensions among them; surely the Shaitan is an open enemy to man.
Your Lord knows you best; He will have mercy on you if He pleases, or He will chastise you if He pleases; and We have not sent you as being in charge of them. 17:53-54

And obey Allah and obey the Messenger, but if you turn back, then upon Our Messenger devolves only the clear delivery (of the message). 64:12

And say: The truth is from your Lord, so let him who please believe, and let him who please disbelieve 18:29

You shall have your religion and I shall have my religion. 109:6

And so on...
No forced conversions. If they have a law that requires it, it is their own doing. It has nothing to do with Islam.

also why is that if ONE parent converts to Islam any susequent children must convert to Islam.

In Islam, the children are required to be raised in the religion of their father.

I also have not seen your answer to Jimmy about apostasy.

See my answer about forced conversion. If there is a death penalty ordered for leaving Islam, then it is a man made law. It is not in the Qur'aan. The only way you can prescribe the death penalty for Apostacy under Shariah Law is if the Apostacy is combined with treason. It's the treason which carries the death penalty.

[Nukeman]

I gotta say you didn't answer a f***ing thing!!!!! You can quote the Koran all you want but what I am asking you is

WHERE IS ALL OF THIS OUTCRY AGAINST FOLLOWERS OF YOUR FAITH DOINg THESE THINGS IN YOUR RELIGIONS NAME.

Dont quote me a couple of speeches because your religion sure as hell was able to organize mass protest for the Mohamod cartoons (in many countries I might add). I have to say if your that thinned skinned that you cant honestly take it in stride you really shouldn't be playing with the rest of the world..

Spare me the Christians get bent out of shape rhetoric as well because you know full well how Christians, Jew's, Hindu's Bhuddist, and so on are treated in Islamic countries!!! When Islamist come to a free country they want to practice their religin freely without persecution yet you dont follow that in your own countries do you!!! You will also begin to demand that people of other faiths, when areound you, start to respect everything you do in yor day to day lives and force YOUR more's and values on them... Why is that??

When a crackpot Christian fringe bastardizes the bible they are very quickley denounced as "nut balls" and not representing the Christian faith.

Yet country after country that profess to follow the path of Islam continue to subjugate their women and children, they continue to allow forced conversion in the name of Islam, they continue to proscribe the death penalty for apostasy, etc.... etc..... I think you see what I mean..

You never did answer in another thread why a male child of the the ripe old age of 5 carries more wait than a woman in the eyes of Muslim men??

Why does a woman have to have such a large number of witnesses to outweigh one man??

Why are women forced to cover up from head to toe yet men aren't required to do the same (if Muslim men can't control themselves around women, than that my friend is a failing on their part not the womans)?

Your religion has 1.5 billion followers yet none of you seem to follow the same path. you really should take a small que from the other religions of the world and establish some sort of standard doctrine instead of leaving everything up to "whoever seems to be in charge at your mosque"


DONT QUOTE THE KORAN ANSWER THE QUESTIONS AS A PERSON WOULD WITH YOUR OWN REASONING AND RATIONAL!!

[glockmail]

Forced conversion is something that is not allowed nor encouraged in Islam.......In Islam, the children are required to be raised in the religion of their father.......

Am I the only one that sees the inconsistency here?

[jimnyc]

Am I the only one that sees the inconsistency here?

I give up on Jafar. Only good Muslims represent his religion. Anyone doing bad is no longer a Muslim. Therefore in his mind, ALL Muslims are good people. Yet if he counter with an argument as I have in a few threads you might still be waiting a week later for answers.

If there were so many Muslims, that really aren't Muslims because they are "bad", then why don't we hear an outcry against them from the Muslim community? Why haven't the leaders went national to explain their position to the world?

Oh, that's right, OBL just did that! Funny how a man in a cave in the middle of nowhere can reach out to the world, but no other leader in the entire Muslim community can do the same.

[Nukeman]

Am I the only one that sees the inconsistency here?

Dont yaa know they aren't real Muslims cause they aren't "good"
What a bunch of horse shit!!!!!!

[diuretic]

A question for those who are running this criticism of Islam all over the forums.

If the Qu'ran expressly forbids something to be done (and remembering that the Qu'ran is the revealed word of God) and some Muslims in fact do it, doesn't it fault them and not their religion?

[glockmail]

A question for those who are running this criticism of Islam all over the forums.

If the Qu'ran expressly forbids something to be done (and remembering that the Qu'ran is the revealed word of God) and some Muslims in fact do it, doesn't it fault them and not their religion?

Jafar is just setting up a strawman, or attempting to. The fact is that a reasonable interpretation of the Koran reveals all kinds of violence towards non-muslims.

[Nukeman]

A question for those who are running this criticism of Islam all over the forums.

If the Qu'ran expressly forbids something to be done (and remembering that the Qu'ran is the revealed word of God) and some Muslims in fact do it, doesn't it fault them and not their religion?

You know its one thing for the Koran to "forbid" something its another as to how these so called Muslim interpret their own holy book.

This is the crux of the problem they have too many interpretations thay dont have a set doctrine to follow. So in essence they are following the book as they see fit.

It would be one thing if it was an occasional nut job out there but your talking whole countries, governments, cities, towns, and villages.

Where is the Huge outcry when these things are done in the name of their religion?? They sure as hell mobilized around the world when a few pictures turned up of their Profit.

On the issue of the cartoons of Muhamod I will point out another hypocracy in the Muslim way of thinking. It has been shown that in almost any market or bazarr in the Mid-east one can purchase a portriat of the Profit Muhamod yet we have days of rioting with hundreds of thousands calling for punishment of a few cartoonist. Do you not see the Hypocracy in all of this????

Jafar can quote all the passages in the Koran he wants, but untill he and others like him stop condoning and start condemning these people and their type of behaviour I will have little to no repect for them...

[retiredman]

Jafar is just setting up a strawman, or attempting to. The fact is that a reasonable interpretation of the Koran reveals all kinds of violence towards non-muslims.

Have you read the Old Testament recently?

[glockmail]

Have you read the Old Testament recently?

Every Sunday.

[retiredman]

Every Sunday.

did you happen to miss the violence contained therein?

[glockmail]

did you happen to miss the violence contained therein?

Did you happen to miss that Christ fullfilled the Scriptures, and His New Covenant? Duh.

[Monkeybone]

so i shouldn't shave my side burns either since it is in the old testament?

does the Koran have a new and an old or is it just one book?

[jafar00]

DONT QUOTE THE KORAN ANSWER THE QUESTIONS AS A PERSON WOULD WITH YOUR OWN REASONING AND RATIONAL!!

Islam is the Qur'aan. How can I answer a question about Islam without referring to the Qur'aan?

I can give you an opinion, but would you then shout at me again because I didn't provide any proofs?

There is no point is there? You have your mind made up already. There is nothing I can say to change it is there?

Funny how a man in a cave in the middle of nowhere can reach out to the world, but no other leader in the entire Muslim community can do the same.

Perhaps you should tell your government and media to stop giving him the kind of publicity that no amount of money can buy in the real world. I'm sure he appreciates the enormous amount of assistance he is getting from you guys, but is it really helping your own cause at all apart from keeping the fear levels up enough so people will give up all of their rights to feel safe again and the govt can pass more laws to keep control of you?

Jafar is just setting up a strawman, or attempting to. The fact is that a reasonable interpretation of the Koran reveals all kinds of violence towards non-muslims.

When taken in, or out of context? When it's read by those with no idea what they are reading, it does seem a little strange in parts. That's why we have teachers and we read it in the original Arabic. :/

so i shouldn't shave my side burns either since it is in the old testament?

does the Koran have a new and an old or is it just one book?

The Qur'aan is one book and it hasn't been changed, revised, or otherwise tampered with since revelation.