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  1. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Drummond View Post
    The BBC is certainly factual when it can be, yes. But it does manipulate, too. It'll attribute great weight to one side of a story, and very little to any aspect not in line with what it wants people to consider.

    The BBC did not menton one word of WMD's (degraded ones) being found by 2006. It said nothing about Santorum's press conference on the subject.

    A couple of years ago, Hamas launched rockets into Israel, precipitating Israel's inevitably strong response. All the BBC could do was concentrate on the 'immense suffering' the Gazan people were suffering from it. Virtually nothing was said of how Israel suffers from Hamas terrorism.

    Consider how terrorism reports are handled, and the ban on calling a terrorist, A TERRORIST, unless someone else already has. What else is that, but attitude-management ?

    As for Brexit (!!) ... the BBC fed us an unrelenting diet of scare stories about Brexit, prompting the Sun newspaper to publish THIS:

    https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/105752...s-licence-fee/



    The BBC is manipulative. It skews stories as it sees fit. That's just a fact, Kathianne.

    Time will tell to see what balance Trump strikes. I'll be very surprised, though, if the BBC doesn't spin it in some fashion.

    For example, they were one news outlet insisting that Trump HAD called Covid-19 'a hoax'.
    I'm not defending the BBC, I don't watch it. I was responding to what YOU wrote of their reporting on Trump and his US reaction to the virus. Nothing more.
    “The greatness of America lies not in being more enlightened than any other nation, but rather in her ability to repair her faults.” De Tocqueville



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  3. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kathianne View Post
    I listen to him whenever I can, including the presser where he was quite adamant, I think BBC is factual, if spinning somewhat left. The thing with this president, you never quite know if he means what he's projecting, he may be projecting that he's going to let the 'economy pop back' whatever the cost, while he actually is going to do something that is much more measured. I hope that's the case here-I think the other would be a disaster. It does seem he's slowly looking like he wants a middle road.
    Speaking of listening to him, caught both the signing and his presser an hour later. Tone is different. 'We really need to get to work, but health and safety have to be first. The economy will follow. I hope it's very soon.'

    Definite change. I think he realized some of his acolytes were going further down a road he wasn't heading. . .
    “The greatness of America lies not in being more enlightened than any other nation, but rather in her ability to repair her faults.” De Tocqueville



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  5. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kathianne View Post
    Speaking of listening to him, caught both the signing and his presser an hour later. Tone is different. 'We really need to get to work, but health and safety have to be first. The economy will follow. I hope it's very soon.'

    Definite change. I think he realized some of his acolytes were going further down a road he wasn't heading. . .
    All very good. Realism is in charge, it seems.

    I often record news broadcasts and review them much later in the day. I just finished watching the BBC's 1pm news (Friday).

    Jane Hill was the 'anchor' for that broadcast.

    Around 12 minutes into the broadcast, America's situation was described, with some pretty grim statistics relayed ... America is evidently now being hit hard by Covid-19.

    However ... BBC 'fake news' to the 'rescue' ! A sentence - not backed by anything at all - was uttered by Jane Hill. Having just rattled off some infection stats, she went on to say .. and I quote .. '... President Trump, though, says the crisis will end quickly'.

    That's verbatim, a totally accurate quote. No 'hope' expressed ... but, a bland promise / assurance of what Trump says WILL happen.

    I don't believe it as an accurate report .. partly because of what I've learned here, partly because the BBC did not, then or subsequently, make any effort to substantiate the statement. Nonetheless, THIS IS WHAT THE BBC REPORTED ... and they've done nothing since to correct that earlier statement. I know .. I watched a later broadcast, at 10pm. Statement not repeated in that broadcast, but not in any way corrected or revised, either.

    Obviously, this was slipped into the news broadcast as part of an effort to discredit Trump as a believable or even competent figure. They've already pushed the idea of Trump rushing to get America 'opened up again, by Easter'. This is meant to suggest Trump's single-mindedness in supposedly ignoring reality to push his own agenda ... lives lost, or not. This is an impression NOT corrected. After all, to do so would defy the BBC's preferred bias.

    This is how Left-wing bias wins out over here. The truth isn't WHAT it is, it's what they SAY it is. We're meant to believe everything we're told. And, a great many here, do.
    Last edited by Drummond; 03-27-2020 at 10:02 PM.
    It's That Bloody Foreigner Again !!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Drummond View Post
    All very good. Realism is in charge, it seems.

    I often record news broadcasts and review them much later in the day. I just finished watching the BBC's 1pm news (Friday).

    Jane Hill was the 'anchor' for that broadcast.

    Around 12 minutes into the broadcast, America's situation was described, with some pretty grim statistics relayed ... America is evidently now being hit hard by Covid-19.

    However ... BBC 'fake news' to the 'rescue' ! A sentence - not backed by anything at all - was uttered by Jane Hill. Having just rattled off some infection stats, she went on to say .. and I quote .. '... President Trump, though, says the crisis will end quickly'.

    That's verbatim, a totally accurate quote. No 'hope' expressed ... but, a bland promise / assurance of what Trump says WILL happen.

    I don't believe it as an accurate report .. partly because of what I've learned here, partly because the BBC did not, then or subsequently, make any effort to substantiate the statement. Nonetheless, THIS IS WHAT THE BBC REPORTED.

    Obviously, this was slipped into the news broadcast as part of an effort to discredit Trump as a believable or even competent figure. They've already pushed the idea of Trump rushing to get America 'opened up again, by Easter'. This is meant to suggest Trump's single-mindedness in supposedly ignoring reality to push his own agenda ... lives lost, or not.

    This is how Left-wing bias wins out over here. The truth isn't WHAT it is, it's what they SAY it is. We're meant to believe everything we're told. And, a great many here, do.
    Trump does say things like that, whether or not he did that time I've no clue. He often talks in absolutisms, then will say something after another sentence or phrase, coming back to the first statement and quantify it, though it's easy to get lost. I think he's too smart not to know what he's doing with that.

    Remember when he said that he could shoot someone on 5th ave or something and deny it and many would agree with him? I think that was a moment when he realized just how literally many took him. I think with his remarks earlier in the week, he realized again just this. The acolytes are pretty dang committed to following both what he says and what they think he really believes. It has to be sort of nerve-wracking to be him.
    “The greatness of America lies not in being more enlightened than any other nation, but rather in her ability to repair her faults.” De Tocqueville



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    Quote Originally Posted by Kathianne View Post
    Trump does say things like that, whether or not he did that time I've no clue. He often talks in absolutisms, then will say something after another sentence or phrase, coming back to the first statement and quantify it, though it's easy to get lost. I think he's too smart not to know what he's doing with that.

    Remember when he said that he could shoot someone on 5th ave or something and deny it and many would agree with him? I think that was a moment when he realized just how literally many took him. I think with his remarks earlier in the week, he realized again just this. The acolytes are pretty dang committed to following both what he says and what they think he really believes. It has to be sort of nerve-wracking to be him.
    Perhaps you're making a very valid point about how Trump leaps in with his 'absolutisms'. But he needs to understand that this is perfect fuel for those wanting to press ahead with a 'fake news' agenda. It's a pure gift to propagandists. Trump makes a bald statement. It gets quoted, perhaps in proper context, perhaps not. It doesn't matter, because those wanting to make propagandist capital out of it simply refuse, or 'somehow conveniently forget' to ever report anything that offers a corrective reconsideration.

    This is what the BBC did with the lunchtime news broadcast. If in fact Trump said what it was reported he'd said, two things were done with that. Firstly, grim statistics were reported. Immediately after that, Trump's totally - apparently - contradictory statement, one seemingly totally ignoring the reality just described, was repeated.

    This could only leave one impression, that of a President whose reality was entirely at odds with the real facts. Possibly this leaves in the mind of the viewer an impression of total incompetence. Or, an impression of a ruthless President who'll get America back to work REGARDLESS of any health considerations ... in other words, Trump may be painted as having a 'business first, human life a very poor second' outlook.

    In other words, as a human being, he's painted as being a total and utter bastard.

    Trrump's ad-hoc 'absolutisms', as you call them, really need to stop, if the fake news industry (of which, apparently, the BBC is a fully paid-up member !) isn't going to be given gifts it then runs with for damaging propagandist effect.
    It's That Bloody Foreigner Again !!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Drummond View Post
    Perhaps you're making a very valid point about how Trump leaps in with his 'absolutisms'. But he needs to understand that this is perfect fuel for those wanting to press ahead with a 'fake news' agenda. It's a pure gift to propagandists. Trump makes a bald statement. It gets quoted, perhaps in proper context, perhaps not. It doesn't matter, because those wanting to make propagandist capital out of it simply refuse, or 'somehow conveniently forget' to ever report anything that offers a corrective reconsideration.

    This is what the BBC did with the lunchtime news broadcast. If in fact Trump said what it was reported he'd said, two things were done with that. Firstly, grim statistics were reported. Immediately after that, Trump's totally - apparently - contradictory statement, one seemingly totally ignoring the reality just described, was repeated.

    This could only leave one impression, that of a President whose reality was entirely at odds with the real facts. Possibly this leaves in the mind of the viewer an impression of total incompetence. Or, an impression of a ruthless President who'll get America back to work REGARDLESS of any health considerations ... in other words, Trump may be painted as having a 'business first, human life a very poor second' outlook.

    In other words, as a human being, he's painted as being a total and utter bastard.

    Trrump's ad-hoc 'absolutisms', as you call them, really need to stop, if the fake news industry (of which, apparently, the BBC is a fully paid-up member !) isn't going to be given gifts it then runs with for damaging propagandist effect.
    You haven't noticed that's exactly what I've been saying all week? He does say these things, then gets the reactions. Sometimes he ignores that he said it; sometimes he fights back, saying 'fake news;' and sometimes he just goes a whole different direction.

    I don't know if his solid, true core actually believe everything he says, it sure seems to be that way. As you know, I'm only recently considering voting for him in Nov., due to Pelosi more than anything else. I don't like cults and many in his core seem as cult-like as do those in the AOC wing of the left.

    I like a degree of skepticism and knowing nearly all running for office are dogs.
    “The greatness of America lies not in being more enlightened than any other nation, but rather in her ability to repair her faults.” De Tocqueville



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    Quote Originally Posted by Kathianne View Post
    You haven't noticed that's exactly what I've been saying all week? He does say these things, then gets the reactions. Sometimes he ignores that he said it; sometimes he fights back, saying 'fake news;' and sometimes he just goes a whole different direction.

    I don't know if his solid, true core actually believe everything he says, it sure seems to be that way. As you know, I'm only recently considering voting for him in Nov., due to Pelosi more than anything else. I don't like cults and many in his core seem as cult-like as do those in the AOC wing of the left.

    I like a degree of skepticism and knowing nearly all running for office are dogs.
    Well, it's stupid. It's a gift to his adversaries. Trump expects situations to be generated, then cries 'fake news' to try and 'prove' a point ?

    The BBC is a case in point. It runs with a preferred quote, set within a context of entirely contradictory evidence, for a given effect. It then does precisely nothing to correct any of it, or to move the story forward with any sign of a corrective development. Result ... the viewer can only believe what's been spoon-fed in a broadcast.

    Trump shouldn't make any statement which can then be misused. His own preferred 'take' on how it pans out need not begin to resemble what hostile propagandists will get up to.

    I don't know about Trump's 'solid, true core'. Accolytes who just act as acquiescent drones .. they don't help anything. Maybe Trump needs robust counsel, instead. Maybe Trump fails himself, by not insisting upon it.

    Your 'knowing nearly all who run for office are dogs' approach wouldn't work well in the UK. Here, you have to know that your hoped-for Leader will be a totally reputable character. Success comes from a display of at least apparent proof of it.

    Corbyn wasn't seen as credible, in December. The electorate turned away from him in droves. Lack of honourable credibility is a political death sentence over here.
    It's That Bloody Foreigner Again !!!

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  12. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by Drummond View Post
    Well, it's stupid. It's a gift to his adversaries. Trump expects situations to be generated, then cries 'fake news' to try and 'prove' a point ?

    The BBC is a case in point. It runs with a preferred quote, set within a context of entirely contradictory evidence, for a given effect. It then does precisely nothing to correct any of it, or to move the story forward with any sign of a corrective development. Result ... the viewer can only believe what's been spoon-fed in a broadcast.

    Trump shouldn't make any statement which can then be misused. His own preferred 'take' on how it pans out need not begin to resemble what hostile propagandists will get up to.

    I don't know about Trump's 'solid, true core'. Accolytes who just act as acquiescent drones .. they don't help anything. Maybe Trump needs robust counsel, instead. Maybe Trump fails himself, by not insisting upon it.

    Your 'knowing nearly all who run for office are dogs' approach wouldn't work well in the UK. Here, you have to know that your hoped-for Leader will be a totally reputable character. Success comes from a display of at least apparent proof of it.

    Corbyn wasn't seen as credible, in December. The electorate turned away from him in droves. Lack of honourable credibility is a political death sentence over here.
    Whoa! If you'd been saying this a few months ago, you'd be called a liberal! LOL!

    One thing I think we can all safely say, Trump hasn't changed. He is what he is and has been.

    Maybe the virus is making some people look outside of their own perspectives or desires?
    “The greatness of America lies not in being more enlightened than any other nation, but rather in her ability to repair her faults.” De Tocqueville



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    Quote Originally Posted by Kathianne View Post
    Whoa! If you'd been saying this a few months ago, you'd be called a liberal! LOL!

    One thing I think we can all safely say, Trump hasn't changed. He is what he is and has been.

    Maybe the virus is making some people look outside of their own perspectives or desires?
    Well, if I was called a liberal, it wouldn't have been for the first time .... totally erroneously, but of course.

    I'm not sure I understand your point.

    Whatever Trump says or does, none of it excuses misrepresentations of him by propagandist broadcasters. Those propagandists know what they do, they have to know it's wrong, but, they do it anyway. I just don't see why Trump makes life easy for them.
    It's That Bloody Foreigner Again !!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Drummond View Post
    Well, if I was called a liberal, it wouldn't have been for the first time .... totally erroneously, but of course.

    I'm not sure I understand your point.

    Whatever Trump says or does, none of it excuses misrepresentations of him by propagandist broadcasters. Those propagandists know what they do, they have to know it's wrong, but, they do it anyway. I just don't see why Trump makes life easy for them.
    If he didn't do these things, he wouldn't be Trump. That. Is. Why.
    “The greatness of America lies not in being more enlightened than any other nation, but rather in her ability to repair her faults.” De Tocqueville



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    Quote Originally Posted by Kathianne View Post
    If he didn't do these things, he wouldn't be Trump. That. Is. Why.
    Well, that's OK.

    If the BBC didn't inject its bias into its reporting, it wouldn't be the BBC.
    It's That Bloody Foreigner Again !!!

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    and here comes the qualifiers, thankfully. Not the end of discussions, but a start:

    https://www.foxbusiness.com/economy/...ng-quarantines

    Published 2 hours agoTrump weighs rolling coronavirus quarantines

    New York City could stay in lockdown longer than more rural areas

    Trump rethinking Easter goal to reopen country, economy: Gasparino
    FOX Business' Charlie Gasparino says the White House is reportedly considering integrating younger people into the workforce when the coronavirus lockdowns end.


    Get all the latest news on coronavirus and more delivered daily to your inbox. Sign up here.


    President Trump may release an updated timeline for when people will return to work, an indication that he is backing off his statement earlier this week that he would like to end the quarantine by Easter Sunday as the lockdown wreaks havoc on the U.S. economy, FOX Business has learned.


    According to people close to the president, he may soon announce an approach that would suggest the quarantines should end on a rolling basis — keeping heavily infected hotspots like New York City shuttered for longer than areas that are only minimally affected.


    People tell FOX Business an announcement on when people may return back to work could come anytime.




    The move would mark a reversal from Trump’s earlier position—on March 24 he told Fox News anchor Bill Hemmer he “would love to have the country opened up and just raring to go by Easter.”


    A White House spokesman didn’t return a call for comment


    Another idea under consideration is to allow young people to return to work while those with a higher risk of serious illness, the elderly and those with underlying conditions remain in self- quarantine.

    As financial markets tank, Trump is eager to get the economy rolling again and deploy workers as quickly as possible. But health experts believe trying to get people back to work too soon could endanger lives and prolong the virus and its impact on the health system and the economy


    But administration officials are worried that the economy could fall into a deep recession and possibly a depression. Even as Congress passed a $2.2 trillion stimulus package to mitigate the economic pain, it will be meaningless unless people can go back to work or spend the money at local restaurants, shops and salons that are currently closed due to social distancing.


    Trump took two big actions Friday that will help mobilize the U.S. response to coronavirus—signing off on the Coronavirus Aid, Relief and Economic Security Act and invoking the Defense Production Act. Trump is using this act to ensure General Motors ventilators necessary for coronavirus patients in critical condition.


    People close to Trump say he is trying to balance the competing concerns of economic health with the health of all Americans and is said to be weighing all options.
    “The greatness of America lies not in being more enlightened than any other nation, but rather in her ability to repair her faults.” De Tocqueville



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    Quote Originally Posted by Kathianne View Post
    and here comes the qualifiers, thankfully. Not the end of discussions, but a start:

    https://www.foxbusiness.com/economy/...ng-quarantines
    I 'checked this out' on the BBC website (I've viewed no TV yet today, & all I've listened to is LBC). This is the BBC's version, below.

    According to this, Trump is at odds with Cuomo over the whole quarantining idea (hardly surprising that the BBC would feature such an argument) ...

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-52079121

    US President Donald Trump has said he is considering imposing a quarantine on New York in a bid to slow the spread of the coronavirus.

    "We'd like to see [it] quarantined because it's a hotspot," he told reporters. "I'm thinking about that."

    He spoke as confirmed cases in the state increased to more than 52,000, with at least 728 deaths.

    But the state's governor, Andrew Cuomo, said he had not discussed such measures with the president.

    "I didn't speak to him about any quarantine," he told reporters shortly after he had spoken with Mr Trump by phone.

    "I haven't had those conversations," he added. "I don't even know what that means."

    New York state has the highest number of cases of Covid-19 in the US.

    Speaking before he left to visit a Navy hospital ship in Virginia, Mr Trump said that "New Jersey [and] certain parts of Connecticut" could also be quarantined under the measures.

    "We might not have to do it but there's a possibility that sometime today we'll do a quarantine — short term [for] two weeks," he said.

    But Mr Cuomo, who was holding a daily press briefing at the time of Mr Trump's comments, expressed concern at the idea.

    "I don't know how that can be legally enforceable," he said. "And from a medical point of view, I don't know what you would be accomplishing."

    "But I can tell you I don't even like the sound of it," he added. "Not even understanding what it is, I don't like the sound of it."
    The BBC love to portray Trump as a divisive figure, every chance they get ....
    Last edited by Drummond; 03-28-2020 at 01:56 PM.
    It's That Bloody Foreigner Again !!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Drummond View Post
    I 'checked this out' on the BBC website (I've viewed no TV yet today, & all I've listened to is LBC). This is the BBC's version, below.

    According to this, Trump is at odds with Cuomo over the whole quarantining idea (hardly surprising that the BBC would feature such an argument) ...

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-52079121



    The BBC love to portray Trump as a divisive figure, every chance they get ....
    LBC just covered this. Their report echoes the BBC version .. highlighting the level of disagreement between Trump and Cuomo.
    It's That Bloody Foreigner Again !!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Drummond View Post
    Well, it's stupid. It's a gift to his adversaries. Trump expects situations to be generated, then cries 'fake news' to try and 'prove' a point ?

    The BBC is a case in point. It runs with a preferred quote, set within a context of entirely contradictory evidence, for a given effect. It then does precisely nothing to correct any of it, or to move the story forward with any sign of a corrective development. Result ... the viewer can only believe what's been spoon-fed in a broadcast.

    Trump shouldn't make any statement which can then be misused. His own preferred 'take' on how it pans out need not begin to resemble what hostile propagandists will get up to.

    I don't know about Trump's 'solid, true core'. Accolytes who just act as acquiescent drones .. they don't help anything. Maybe Trump needs robust counsel, instead. Maybe Trump fails himself, by not insisting upon it.

    Your 'knowing nearly all who run for office are dogs' approach wouldn't work well in the UK. Here, you have to know that your hoped-for Leader will be a totally reputable character. Success comes from a display of at least apparent proof of it.

    Corbyn wasn't seen as credible, in December. The electorate turned away from him in droves. Lack of honourable credibility is a political death sentence over here.
    @Kathianne ...

    -- Resurrecting this 'Trump's statements are a propagandist gift to adversaries' point, because of what I've continued to hear on LBC Radio.

    I didn't see it (the BBC usually relays instances like this). But apparently, Trump gave a news conference yesterday, in which he indulged in some self-praise ? Something about commenting on how good his ratings had become ?

    Two of LBC's reporters reacted very badly to that, and of course, they gave vent to their opinions, on-air.

    First up was Tom Swarbrick. He is relatively neutral on Trump, usually. Not 'for', but not notably 'against', either. But in reaction, Swarbrick branded Trump a 'dangerous narcissist'.

    The other, just a couple of hours ago, was James O'Brien. O'Brien is far more 'anti-Trump', and sometimes vitriolic with it. His comment in reaction was predictable: 'A despicable human being' was O'Brien's judgment.

    O'Brien had another comment reserved for Trump's public declaration of his refusal to fund Harry and Meghan's security needs. He attributed that refusal to 'a clear example of racism against Meghan'. He said this refusal was all the more remarkable, as the couple had made no request for funding in the first place.

    My point is this: Trump REALLY needs to be guarded and careful in what he publicly says !! Because, as matters stand, he's a propagandist gift for all those who want to bring him down.

    Swarbrick isn't even particularly anti-Trump (not compared with many). People, here, WILL listen to such commentators and be influenced by them. They'll believe in Trump being 'despicable'. They'll even judge America badly, on the basis that Trump, by their reckoning, 'should not' be supporting Trump.

    Trump is a propagandist gift to his enemies, and his lack of care in such matters could turn entire nations against him.

    This needs to stop !!
    It's That Bloody Foreigner Again !!!

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