America Divided: Voters Blame Biden

[Russ]

there are good things that he did and good things that happened while he was in office. Those are not the same thing.

A leader reacts to things that happens. biden is clearly failing at things that are happening just as trump clearly failed at some things that happened. He failed at responding to the riots and he failed at responding to covid. That's why he's no longer POTUS and why he is not among the best world leaders in history.

I stand by my statement that all the good things happening during the Trump administration were the direct result of his policies. He allowed pipelines, drilling, and fracking that gave us the oil supply. He strengthened the border with the wall and the stay in Mexico agreement. He responded strongly to attacks on US forces from Iran. He made the US business and jobs friendly with lower taxes and less regulation (people can argue downsides to that one maybe). I didn't even mention the Abrahamic Accords and Operation Warp Speed, two policies of his that I think were very impressive.

He is not President anymore strictly because of constant and virulent attacks from the mainstream media, mostly based on nothing. The Russia attacks have recently been shown to be a complete hoax, and a friendly or even neutral media would have held off on the attacks. If Trump was treated the way Biden is, he'd still be President. Is Biden were treated the way Trump was, he'd be impeached and probably out of office.

[fj1200]

I stand by my statement that all the good things happening during the Trump administration were the direct result of his policies.

I didn't say good things didn't happen. trump is a buffoon. Darin's statement was wrong.

[Russ]

I didn't say good things didn't happen. trump is a buffoon. Darin's statement was wrong.

But you're arguing that the good things that happened were accidental and Trump deserves no credit. I'm saying that is incorrect. All the very good things I listed were the direct result of policies created by Trump. I understand people disliking him, but the point is that for whatever reason, he instituted policies that worked.

I would even go further to say that you'd be hard pressed to come up with a bad thing that happened during his Presidency that was his fault. Covid - not his fault. George Floyd riots - not his fault. Not stopping the riots - the fault of liberal city mayors not asking for him to send in the National Guard - some even saying "stay out".

I'm just being objective - Trump might bluster and have an ego problem but his policies very much helped America.

[Kathianne]

But you're arguing that the good things that happened were accidental and Trump deserves no credit. I'm saying that is incorrect. All the very good things I listed were the direct result of policies created by Trump. I understand people disliking him, but the point is that for whatever reason, he instituted policies that worked.

I would even go further to say that you'd be hard pressed to come up with a bad thing that happened during his Presidency that was his fault. Covid - not his fault. George Floyd riots - not his fault. Not stopping the riots - the fault of liberal city mayors not asking for him to send in the National Guard - some even saying "stay out".

I'm just being objective - Trump might bluster and have an ego problem but his policies very much helped America.

I wouldn't disagree with most of this and will even give a nod towards some of his overstatement working for US in foreign affairs.

What was bad about Trump were many of the same that was wrong with Obama, though vastly different styles.

Both were divisive, both through transparent and extremely opaque rhetoric. That doesn't mean Obama was successful policy wise; while mostly Trump was.

I've said from the very start, character and how one projects oneself as POTUS does matter. The media played for Obama, though many were disillusioned by 2012, just not enough.

I've said many times, I fervently wish there were a conservative that wasn't a minion , but could rally the people for Trump policies without the divisive elements inherent in his style.

[Abbey Marie]

I replied to Darin about good policies of Trumps; but Biden is where he is, simply for not being Trump.

Biden though is much worse in most ways, including his unethical behaviors. Biden also was accused of sexual assault if not rape.

I agree with your “not-Trump” point. But with a caveat. I believe that you can fill in the name of any Republican President who unapologetically made the kind of changes Trump did, and the result would be the same. Yes, Trump’s in-your-face immature personality grated on many people, there is no doubt about it. But his policies bothered them more, IMO. Had he been your typical do-nothing, compromising President, he may have been re-elected. Instead, he pushed the envelope and enacted big changes.

Not to mention Biden being helped along by the influence of foreign governments scared to death of what another 4 years of Trump might look like.

[Kathianne]

I agree with your “not-Trump” point. But with a caveat. I believe that you can fill in the name of any Republican President who unapologetically made the kind of changes Trump did, and the result would be the same. Yes, Trump’s in-your-face immature personality grated on many people, there is no doubt about it. But his policies bothered them more, IMO. Had he been your typical do-nothing, compromising President, he may have been re-elected. Instead, he pushed the envelope and enacted big changes.

Not to mention Biden being helped along by the influence of foreign governments scared to death of what another 4 years of Trump might look like.

The media's role in Trump losing and making his presidency so difficult is impossible to measure.

I think his behavior justied the media in many people's eyes, thus his losing to Biden, God help us.

I'm not convinced it was his policies that did him in by any measure. Polling for Trump was the inverse of Biden or Obama for that matter. Until Biden really screwed Afghanistan, like Obama his approval ratings were good. However, when looking at responses on the policies, both Biden and Obama came out very badly. Obamacare never polled well.

Many did not approve of Trump, but they gave much better ratings on policies.

[fj1200]

But you're arguing that the good things that happened were accidental and Trump deserves no credit.

I haven't made that argument. At. All. But I don't blindly give credit where none is due. Inflation for example; he pretty much has zero control over it and an argument could be made that he sowed the seeds of inflation by flapping his mouth at the Fed Chairman just like LBJ.

[Gunny]

I wouldn't disagree with most of this and will even give a nod towards some of his overstatement working for US in foreign affairs.

What was bad about Trump were many of the same that was wrong with Obama, though vastly different styles.

Both were divisive, both through transparent and extremely opaque rhetoric. That doesn't mean Obama was successful policy wise; while mostly Trump was.

I've said from the very start, character and how one projects oneself as POTUS does matter. The media played for Obama, though many were disillusioned by 2012, just not enough.

I've said many times, I fervently wish there were a conservative that wasn't a minion , but could rally the people for Trump policies without the divisive elements inherent in his style.

Ditto. Problem is, it takes an establishment minion to fill part of the bill, and a Trump the other. I haven't noticed anyone near close that, even these had-line Governors are part of the established system. Any other outsider will get the same treatment Trump did if not worse.

[Kathianne]

Sure it did, Biden is where he is because of not being Trump.

I really do not want a large scale reenactment of GA's Senate races:

https://theweek.com/donald-trump/100...-about-himself

[Gunny]

I really do not want a large scale reenactment of GA's Senate races:

https://theweek.com/donald-trump/100...-about-himself

I don't want a reenactment the left's/MSM's/anti-Trumper's of 2016-2020.

And I guess I'll just be the first to say it in my usual, tactful manner: Trump is pissing me off. I don't see anything he has done since the election as more than just damage to the right. Stolen, fair or whatever, the election went to Biden on the books. Move the f- on. He's presenting himself as an impetuous, petty little toddler that isn't getting his way.

Yes, I will probably STILL vote for him, if he's the candidate, against a Dem. They're just plain evil anymore. But that isn't saying much.

[Black Diamond]

I don't want a reenactment the left's/MSM's/anti-Trumper's of 2016-2020.

And I guess I'll just be the first to say it in my usual, tactful manner: Trump is pissing me off. I don't see anything he has done since the election as more than just damage to the right. Stolen, fair or whatever, the election went to Biden on the books. Move the f- on. He's presenting himself as an impetuous, petty little toddler that isn't getting his way.

Yes, I will probably STILL vote for him, if he's the candidate, against a Dem. They're just plain evil anymore. But that isn't saying much.

Well that's how I was in 2008. I was considering third party because I didn't like McCain. Then I found out about where Obama went to church I said oh this MFer is a problem and needs to be stopped.