Atlas Shrugged

[truthmatters]

I read this and the fountainhead in high school on my own accord along with many ohter books. I found them both boring and tedious to read. I was not taken with the main charactor at all. They were some of the few books from my self impelled reading that I did not like. Im just not a selfish enough person to understand her ideas on the good of shelfishness.

[Said1]

I read this and the fountainhead in high school on my own accord along with many ohter books. I found them both boring and tedious to read. I was not taken with the main charactor at all. They were some of the few books from my self impelled reading that I did not like. Im just not a selfish enough person to understand her ideas on the good of shelfishness.

There is something about ineptitude at the beginning of Atlas Shrugged that I liked a lot. Yurt, can you did up the quote since you probably have the book handy.

[truthmatters]

http://www.noblesoul.com/orc/books/rand/vos.html

Ayn Rand was all about the virtue of selfishness. I do not conscribe to that notion. Many on the right seem to love the undercurrent of this in her books. I did not.

[Said1]

http://www.noblesoul.com/orc/books/rand/vos.html

Ayn Rand was all about the virtue of selfishness. I do not conscribe to that notion. Many on the right seem to love the undercurrent of this in her books. I did not.

Yep. According to the first web site that popped up after googling.

I thought you would like objectionism.

[Sitarro]

http://www.noblesoul.com/orc/books/rand/vos.html

Ayn Rand was all about the virtue of selfishness. I do not conscribe to that notion. Many on the right seem to love the undercurrent of this in her books. I did not.

So basically you are saying that you didn't understand anything about what she says in either book......... that would explain a lot about many of your previous thoughts over the last year. China is still doing that communist crap and Hugo is trying hard to show the world how great socialism is, maybe you might feel more comfortable in their countries.

You are just like the people in The Fountainhead that wanted to steal Howard Roarks genius, change it to suit their lack of taste and then claim it as their own for the "common good"......... you just don't get it at all.

[truthmatters]

Then why dont you explain to me what her book "the virtue of Selfishness" is all about?

Ayn Rand is to me one of the most over rated writers in modern history.

This is the sites discription of the book.

AYN RAND here sets forth the moral principles of Objectivism, the philosophy that holds that man's life -- the life proper to a rational being -- as the standard of moral values and regards altruism as incompatible with man's nature, with the creative requirements of his survival, and with a free society. (From a Signet paperback printing.)

[Said1]

Then why dont you explain to me what her book "the virtue of Selfishness" is all about?

Ayn Rand is to me one of the most over rated writers in modern history.

Ayn Rand was more than just a 'writer'.

This is the sites discription of the book.

AYN RAND here sets forth the moral principles of Objectivism, the philosophy that holds that man's life -- the life proper to a rational being -- as the standard of moral values and regards altruism as incompatible with man's nature, with the creative requirements of his survival, and with a free society. (From a Signet paperback printing.)

Do you even know what the above means? For example, do you know, even roughly what the term 'rational being' refers to? Altruism?

[truthmatters]

as the standard of moral values and regards altruism as incompatible with man's nature, with the creative requirements of his survival, and with a free society


I know very well what this means.

People who agree with this concept are the ones who think this is true.

Thankfully many Human beings dont agree that altruism is incompatable with mans nature.

I would like you to ponder deeply why you agree with that statement and get back to me.

[Said1]

as the standard of moral values and regards altruism as incompatible with man's nature, with the creative requirements of his survival, and with a free society


I know very well what this means.

No you don't. You copied and pasted some words. I'm not sure why you picked those words. Can you explain?

People who agree with this concept are the ones who think this is true.

You wouldn't know because you don't know what the terms mean, as is evident above.

Thankfully many Human beings dont agree that altruism is incompatable with mans nature.

I would like you to ponder deeply why you agree with that statement and get back to me.

I would like you do ponder deeply as to why you think (that's you, not someone else you plan on quoting and pasting) I agree with the statement you pasted- or at least quote my words.

[truthmatters]

When I read her books I read them as a 16 , 17 year old kid with no instruction. I read them for pleasure on my own. I had no one there telling me what to think about what they meant to them and the scholors ideas on what they meant.

I did not like the contained ideas and found the book full of selfagrandising Charactors who felt above other humans.

Then I ran acrossed the lovely little book "the virtue of selfishness" in collage and felt I completetly understood her work all by my little teenaged self without someone telling what to think.

You go ahead and study her Ideas and what she labeled them if you like. I went on to other ideas that had more merit.


Those words I quoted were from the sight which is describing the book. It is what the book is about. Did you read it?

[Sitarro]

When I read her books I read them as a 16 , 17 year old kid with no instruction. I read them for pleasure on my own. I had no one there telling me what to think about what they meant to them and the scholors ideas on what they meant.

I did not like the contained ideas and found the book full of selfagrandising Charactors who felt above other humans.

Then I ran acrossed the lovely little book "the virtue of selfishness" in collage and felt I completetly understood her work all by my little teenaged self without someone telling what to think.

You go ahead and study her Ideas and what she labeled them if you like. I went on to other ideas that had more merit.


Those words I quoted were from the sight which is describing the book. It is what the book is about. Did you read it?

collage???? What did you study at collage, how to paste things on top of one another?

[truthmatters]

Wow you have found I misspelled a word?

I guess that means selfishness is a wonderful virtue huh?

Now do you have anything of import to add?

[Said1]

When I read her books I read them as a 16 , 17 year old kid with no instruction. I read them for pleasure on my own. I had no one there telling me what to think about what they meant to them and the scholors ideas on what they meant.

I did not like the contained ideas and found the book full of selfagrandising Charactors who felt above other humans.

Fair enough. I guess.

Then I ran acrossed the lovely little book "the virtue of selfishness" in collage and felt I completetly understood her work all by my little teenaged self without someone telling what to think.

I don't think you do. But it's all good anyway.

You go ahead and study her Ideas and what she labeled them if you like. I went on to other ideas that had more merit.

Such as? Who's countering ideas did you consider more 'meritable'? Why do you think doing good for selfis reasons is bad? Rand differentiates between a shopping and philanthropy. Both can and are acts that promote one's well being and happieness. Where are you at odds with that?

Questioning your statements promote discussion. Asking you to elaborate is not a 'gotcha' set up, as you seem to sometimes think. Serious question.

Those words I quoted were from the sight which is describing the book. It is what the book is about. Did you read it?

Yes, I know. Twice, you quoted a very simplistic description of the introduction in a book containing several essays. And yes, I have read it. I might give Fountain Head a chance, but I was turned off by Atlas.

[truthmatters]

Nietzsche, Dostoevsky were a couple.

Im not trying to pretend to be some great source of knowledge on any of these writers. I was a teenage kid who wanted to know what the "educated people" of the world knew and thought. I wanted to be able to think and understand the intellectual world. This is why I was so determined to go to college even though no one in my family ever had. This is why libraries are wonderful things and why I will never give up on helping others. Helping others is the greatest thing another human can do in my mind. Many philosophers agree with me on this one. We are pack animals us humans and it is essential to our entire beings to help each other.

Ayn Rand and her books approach cult status with some people and I am sorry if I mistook you for one of those people. I do find the ideas interesting but I also find them very flawed. Many on the right see them as a type of philosphophical bible. It really makes me sad to think so many feel the virtue of selfishness is a good idea for mankind.

[Said1]

Nietzsche, Dostoevsky were a couple.

Ahhhhhh, Nietzsche! Run for the hills.

Im not trying to pretend to be some great source of knowledge on any of these writers. I was a teenage kid who wanted to know what the "educated people" of the world knew and thought. I wanted to be able to think and understand the intellectual world. This is why I was so determined to go to college even though no one in my family ever had. This is why libraries are wonderful things and why I will never give up on helping others. Helping others is the greatest thing another human can do in my mind. Many philosophers agree with me on this one. We are pack animals us humans and it is essential to our entire beings to help each other.

Ayn Rand and her books approach cult status with some people and I am sorry if I mistook you for one of those people. I do find the ideas interesting but I also find them very flawed. Many on the right see them as a type of philosphophical bible. It really makes me sad to think so many feel the virtue of selfishness is a good idea for mankind.

Rand doesn't advocate not helping others. I constantly have this arguement with my mother. She claims that working as an advocate is selfless, since it involves helping others - often at a great cost to herself. I say that isn't exactly true, because she likes it. In fact, she's addicted to it. Helping others promotes her well being and makes her very happy - which is selfish. She would be very unhappy if she didn't spend every waking moment fighting 'the man'. (And that is NO joke. ) Moreover, what's really funny is that she doesn't do things with and for organizations she doesn't like, even if those activities do help people, a lot. She considers how it affects her, personally before she commits - not the lives of those involved.

Anyway, that's a VERY simplified version of 'the virtue of selfishness' and I'm not much for philosophy that extends beyond politics in the first place. It's too open ended. I like a beginning, a middle and an end.