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    Default The modern worship of Baal?

    A strong argument that people are worshiping Baal without even realizing it.











    If we were as industrious to become good as to make ourselves great, we should become really great by being good, and the number of valuable men would be much increased; but it is a grand mistake to think of being great without goodness; and i pronounce it as certain that there was never yet a truly great man that was not at the same time truly virtuous." - Ben Franklin

    Imagine what good we can do if we all joined together, united as followers of Christ - M. Russell Ballard

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    haven't seen the vids yet - but the premise bothers me; I suppose I believe one cannot accidentally worship anything.
    “… the greatest detractor from high performance is fear: fear that you are not prepared, fear that you are in over your head, fear that you are not worthy, and ultimately, fear of failure. If you can eliminate that fear—not through arrogance or just wishing difficulties away, but through hard work and preparation—you will put yourself in an incredibly powerful position to take on the challenges you face" - Pete Carroll.

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    Firstly how on earth do you guys watch television? A 3 of the 6 clips are 8:30 mins, 2 are 15 mins, and the last one was under 5 mins all separated with adverts? =/

    Seemed pretty disjoined but a few notes -

    The BEST clip was the start to the Thrid part, which opens with videos of riots and then the caption comes "WHAT TYPE OF GOD APPROVES OF VIOLENCE" obviously they're wanting you to think baal...because, of course, the god of the old testament never approved of violence in any shape form or fashion xD

    Another amusing moment was when Beck said that the book/film Lord Of The Flies "proves" how darwinism could never work, oh dear xD

    Baal itself is basically sin, as DMP said above, its not so much that anyone is worshipping anything, however, i can garuneetee there is not a person on this board who could not be said to be "worshipping" baal, the way it is presented in the videos

    And when did the baal really start to pick up speed in america? Ofcourse when the Pill was introduced. Same old points from the religious right, woman having control over their own body leading to the ultimate downfall of civilisation...

    Towards the end i think the show loses the plot a little, and just goes on an all out attack on secularism and environmentalism (i hope none of you christians recycle your waste or try to live lest wasteful lives, because thats a 'sacrament of the secular church' don't ya know')

    I don't think anyone will deny they fact that we have become a greedier, needier culture, far less sensitive to sex and violence, however, to sprinkle it with meta-physics and call it a god is unnecessary imo.
    If you also agree that an animals suffering should be avoided rather than encouraged, consider what steps you can take.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Noir View Post
    Firstly how on earth do you guys watch television? A 3 of the 6 clips are 8:30 mins, 2 are 15 mins, and the last one was under 5 mins all separated with adverts? =/

    Seemed pretty disjoined but a few notes -

    The BEST clip was the start to the Thrid part, which opens with videos of riots and then the caption comes "WHAT TYPE OF GOD APPROVES OF VIOLENCE" obviously they're wanting you to think baal...because, of course, the god of the old testament never approved of violence in any shape form or fashion xD

    Another amusing moment was when Beck said that the book/film Lord Of The Flies "proves" how darwinism could never work, oh dear xD

    Baal itself is basically sin, as DMP said above, its not so much that anyone is worshipping anything, however, i can garuneetee there is not a person on this board who could not be said to be "worshipping" baal, the way it is presented in the videos

    And when did the baal really start to pick up speed in america? Ofcourse when the Pill was introduced. Same old points from the religious right, woman having control over their own body leading to the ultimate downfall of civilisation...

    Towards the end i think the show loses the plot a little, and just goes on an all out attack on secularism and environmentalism (i hope none of you christians recycle your waste or try to live lest wasteful lives, because thats a 'sacrament of the secular church' don't ya know')

    I don't think anyone will deny they fact that we have become a greedier, needier culture, far less sensitive to sex and violence, however, to sprinkle it with meta-physics and call it a god is unnecessary imo.


    We curse a LOT and channel-surf.
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    Quote Originally Posted by avatar4321 View Post
    A strong argument that people are worshiping Baal without even realizing it.











    Glenn Beck...? Really?
    Fascism has come to America, wrapped in a flag and carrying a cross. His name is Trump.
    War is peace. Freedom is slavery. Ignorance is strength. - George Orwell...The New GOP motto.

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    Quote Originally Posted by bullypulpit View Post
    Glenn Beck...? Really?
    I didn't think Beck was in anyway unreasonable. The tone throughout was measured (probably because Beck and the Rabbi were in total agreement throughout) and even though they started to wonder of course somewhat at the end, the majority of the discussion was on message. So I don't think the fact that it was Beck is a talking point.
    If you also agree that an animals suffering should be avoided rather than encouraged, consider what steps you can take.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Noir View Post
    ...

    Baal itself is basically sin, as DMP said above, its not so much that anyone is worshipping anything, however, i can garuneetee there is not a person on this board who could not be said to be "worshipping" baal, the way it is presented in the videos
    ...
    I don't think anyone will deny they fact that we have become a greedier, needier culture, far less sensitive to sex and violence, however, to sprinkle it with meta-physics and call it a god is unnecessary imo.
    just some rambling thoughts...

    To pin it all on Baal is ready metaphor for much of what's going on today. But the fact that people set up justifications for certain sins and promote them as Good. Turns them into Ideological Idols. In the old days the Idols had certain characteristics and promoted certain concepts -Sex as tool of pleasure, wiht few rules- for example. Baal in some of it's forms fit well with some modern cultural idea's.
    The metaphisyic , of it I believe is a reality. Many won't go there but It's a part of the package. the Bible says that people fall into to sins "but each person is tempted when they are dragged away by their own evil desire and enticed." The dersire is in us already to certian things, but there are spirtual forces that promote the negative desires as well. many people cliam to lead into deviant acts by spirits and some worship the sexual impluse or divine feminine, or aspects of power over others. some see power in shedding of blood of others as a way to spiritual power. When you look at a Charles mason type there seems to be more to it than just people behaving badly.

    the Bible states and many Christians and former spiritualist report that the demonic world is very active and personal.
    The concept of worshiping an idol is at the same time conceptual or metaphorical and spiritual.

    "Do I mean then that food sacrificed to an idol is anything, or that an idol is anything? 20 No, but the sacrifices of pagans are offered to demons, not to God, and I do not want you to be participants with demons."

    the Idols are just pieces of rock or wood but there are Ideas (baduns) and spiritual beings behind um as well.

    Funny how when we think an idea is the way to go that instead of the idea becoming a servant to us we often become a servent to it. the idea that Power or Sex is .... or that scinece is... or humans should... becomes the master, and worshipped and defended as a god. not to be challeged.

    there's a book i read a while back that goes into more than one idol that western culture has adopted, more in the ideologiacal sense and how they a "spirit" and Anti God. It's an amzing piece a work and anit light reading. Here's the talbe of contents





    Idols for Destruction
    The Conflict of Christian Faith and American Culture
    By Herbert Schlossberg

    TABLE OF CONTENTS
    Acknowledgements
    Forward by Charles W. Colson
    Preface by Robert H. Bork
    Introduction

    CHAPTER ONE: Idols of History
    History as a Religious Enterprise
    The Cult of Historicism
    History as Lord of the Universe
    Getting in Step with History
    Inevitable Progress
    La Trahison des Clercs: History as a Polemical Device
    The Historical Profession
    The Myth of the Seamless Web
    The Christian View of History
    God’s Action in History
    Judgment
    Judgment and Mercy
    Consequences of the Christian View of History

    CHAPTER TWO: Idols of Humanity
    Human Beings as Gods
    The Ethics of Antinomianism
    The Function of Law as Ethical Foundation
    Subjective Pragmatism
    Humanitarianism
    Ressentiment
    Equalitarianism
    The Misuse of Guilt
    The Poverty Issue
    Poverty and Culture
    Poverty and Work
    Poverty and Dependency
    The Curse of Ontological Victimhood
    The Poor Countries
    Domination by Classification
    The Exercise of Power
    Issues of Life and Death
    The Degradation of Humanity
    The Irrationality of Humanism
    Humanism and the Future

    CHAPTER THREE: Idols of Mammon
    Covetousness and Theft
    The Alchemist as Theif
    Inflation
    The Role of Banking in the Inflationary Process
    Politics and Inflation
    Inflation as Redistribution
    The Consequences of Inflation
    Envy and Economics
    Morality and Economics
    Materialism
    Redistribution
    Redistribution to the Rich
    Redistribution to Business and Industry
    The Political Payoff
    The Politics of Pressure Groups
    The Power of the State over Economic Life
    Bureaucratic Domination
    Price Controls
    Autonomous Officialdom
    The Failure to Invest
    The Role of Profit in the Economy
    The Onset of Poverty
    Freedom and Coercion
    The Evasion of Evil
    The Failure of Mammon

    CHAPTER FOUR: Idols of Nature
    Nature and History
    Nature as the Whole Show
    Science as Religion
    Social Science as Ideology
    Reductionism and the Sociology of Knowledge
    Reason as Lord of the Universe
    The Triumph of the Irrational
    Assault from the East
    Nature as Lord of the Universe
    The Triumph of the Irrational
    Assault from the East
    Nature as Lord of the Universe
    The Effects of Naturalist Irrationality
    The Cult of Narcissism
    A World Become Spooky
    Second Face of Janus
    Nature in Control
    The Riddle of the One and the Many
    Prolegomena to Any Christian Epistemology

    CHAPTER FIVE: Idols of Power
    The Creation of Leviathan
    God Marching on Earth
    Only the State Can Save Us
    A Moral Revolution
    Our Father, the State
    The State as Idol
    Creating Utopia
    The Rule of the Elite
    The New Gnosticism
    The Apotheosis of Power
    Scholars-on-Pension
    The Shepherds and the Sheep
    Bureaucrats, Politicians, and the Exercise of Power
    Khadi Law and the End of Justice
    Power through the Religion of the Schools
    Individualism and Its Enemies
    Inferior Magistrates as Countervailing Powers
    The Family under Attack
    The Attack on Economic Resistance to the State
    Freedom as a Vice
    The Question of Totalitarianism
    The Vision of Global Unity
    The Irrationality of Statism
    The Sacralization of Power

    CHAPTER SIX: Idols of Religion
    Anti-Clericalism as a Biblical Theme
    False Religion in the Early Church
    The Conformity of American Religion
    Loss of Intellectual Underpinnings
    Humanism and the Church
    The War against Economics
    Churches of the Messianic State
    Theology in the Service of Revolution
    Civil Religion and the Churches
    The Checkered Church
    Democratic Idolatry
    The Kingdom Coopted

    CHAPTER SEVEN: Consequences and Expectations
    Understanding the Present and Forecasting the Future
    History as a Moral Universe
    Foul Is Useful and Fair Is Not
    Moral Man and Immoral Society
    Moralism and Guilt in the Absence of Morality
    Paganism Revisited: The Mimetic Inversion
    The Breakdown of Intellect
    Religious Secularity
    Manifestations of Religious Warfare
    The End of Prosperity
    A Society Feeding on its Future
    A Society Marked By Strife
    Antinomianism as an Accompaniment to Decline
    Ethics in a Post-Christian Society
    The Drive for Power Accelerates
    Poverty and Power
    The Onset of Judgment
    A Society Transformed

    CHAPTER EIGHT: The New Community
    The Dual Vision of Righteousness
    Prolegomena to any Christian Metaphysic
    Freedom and Responsibility
    Prolegomena to any Christian Ethic
    Idolatry and Injustice
    Society and Its Dissenters
    Defying Mammon
    Responsibilities of the Rich and the Poor
    The Stewardship of Wealth
    Unity among the Faithful
    Defying the Powers
    The Preservation of Intellect
    Christ against the World
    Toward the Triumph of Justice
    Persecution
    Embarking on the Great Adventure
    Index
    It is proper to take alarm at the first experiment on our liberties. The freeman of America did not wait till usurped power had strengthened itself by exercise, and entangled the question in precedents. James Madison
    Live as free people, yet without employing your freedom as a pretext for wickedness; but live at all times as servants of God.
    1 Peter 2:16

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    Quote Originally Posted by Noir View Post


    I didn't think Beck was in anyway unreasonable. The tone throughout was measured (probably because Beck and the Rabbi were in total agreement throughout) and even though they started to wonder of course somewhat at the end, the majority of the discussion was on message. So I don't think the fact that it was Beck is a talking point.
    You don't know Glenn Beck the way Americans do. He'a walking, breathing, excreting talking point. Not to metion he's bat-crap crazy.
    Fascism has come to America, wrapped in a flag and carrying a cross. His name is Trump.
    War is peace. Freedom is slavery. Ignorance is strength. - George Orwell...The New GOP motto.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Noir View Post


    I didn't think Beck was in anyway unreasonable. The tone throughout was measured (probably because Beck and the Rabbi were in total agreement throughout) and even though they started to wonder of course somewhat at the end, the majority of the discussion was on message. So I don't think the fact that it was Beck is a talking point.
    You have to understand, that to some just pointing out that it's Glenn talking about it gives them an excuse to ignore what's being said.
    If we were as industrious to become good as to make ourselves great, we should become really great by being good, and the number of valuable men would be much increased; but it is a grand mistake to think of being great without goodness; and i pronounce it as certain that there was never yet a truly great man that was not at the same time truly virtuous." - Ben Franklin

    Imagine what good we can do if we all joined together, united as followers of Christ - M. Russell Ballard

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    Quote Originally Posted by bullypulpit View Post
    You don't know Glenn Beck the way Americans do. He'a walking, breathing, excreting talking point. Not to metion he's bat-crap crazy.
    Do you understand your opinion of the videos is based on a logical fallacy? Does that even matter to you?
    “… the greatest detractor from high performance is fear: fear that you are not prepared, fear that you are in over your head, fear that you are not worthy, and ultimately, fear of failure. If you can eliminate that fear—not through arrogance or just wishing difficulties away, but through hard work and preparation—you will put yourself in an incredibly powerful position to take on the challenges you face" - Pete Carroll.

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    Quote Originally Posted by dmp View Post
    Do you understand your opinion of the videos is based on a logical fallacy? Does that even matter to you?
    It's never bothered any of his other opinions based on logical fallacy.
    If we were as industrious to become good as to make ourselves great, we should become really great by being good, and the number of valuable men would be much increased; but it is a grand mistake to think of being great without goodness; and i pronounce it as certain that there was never yet a truly great man that was not at the same time truly virtuous." - Ben Franklin

    Imagine what good we can do if we all joined together, united as followers of Christ - M. Russell Ballard

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    Ba'al is a divine title in Hebrew. It means "master". Christians have demonized the term.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Wind Song View Post
    Ba'al is a divine title in Hebrew. It means "master". Christians have demonized the term.
    um yeah it' means, "lord" some time and the devil is an angel too. but that doesn't quite tell the whole story.
    tthese are a few old testaments vs.



    1 Kings 18:21 Elijah came near to all the people, and said, "How long will you waver between the two sides? If Yahweh is God, follow him; but if Baal, then follow him." The people answered him not a word

    1 Kings 18:40 Elijah said to them, "Seize the prophets of Baal! Don't let one of them escape!" They seized them. Elijah brought them down to the brook Kishon, and killed them there.

    1kings 22:
    52
    And he did evil in the sight of the LORD, and walked in the way of his father, and in the way of his mother, and in the way of Jeroboam the son of Nebat, who made Israel to sin: 53For he served Baal, and worshipped him, and provoked to anger the LORD God of Israel, according to all that his father had done.


    I don't think the Christians rewrote or "demonized" the the old testament term for the Jews here.


    Numbers 25:3 Israel joined himself to Baal Peor: and the anger of Yahweh was kindled against Israel. (See RSV)
    Numbers 25:5 Moses said to the judges of Israel, "Everyone kill his men who have joined themselves to Baal Peor." (See RSV)
    Deuteronomy 4:3 Your eyes have seen what Yahweh did because of Baal Peor; for all the men who followed Baal Peor, Yahweh your God has destroyed them from the midst of you. (See RSV)
    Judges 6:25 That night the LORD said to him, "Take your father's bull, the second bull seven years old, and pull down the altar of Ba'al which your father has, and cut down the Ashe'rah that is beside it; (DBY RSV)
    Judges 6:28 When the men of the town rose early in the morning, behold, the altar of Ba'al was broken down, and the Ashe'rah beside it was cut down, and the second bull was offered upon the altar which had been built. (DBY RSV)
    Judges 6:30 Then the men of the town said to Jo'ash, "Bring out your son, that he may die, for he has pulled down the altar of Ba'al and cut down the Ashe'rah beside it." (DBY RSV)
    Judges 6:31 But Jo'ash said to all who were arrayed against him, "Will you contend for Ba'al? Or will you defend his cause? Whoever contends for him shall be put to death by morning. If he is a god, let him contend for himself, because his altar has been pulled down." (DBY RSV)
    Judges 6:32 Therefore on that day he was called Jerubba'al, that is to say, "Let Ba'al contend against him," because he pulled down his altar. (Root in DBY RSV)
    1 Kings 16:31 It happened, as if it had been a light thing for him to walk in the sins of Jeroboam the son of Nebat, that he took as wife Jezebel the daughter of Ethbaal king of the Sidonians, and went and served Baal, and worshiped him. (See RSV)
    1 Kings 16:32 He reared up an altar for Baal in the house of Baal, which he had built in Samaria. (See RSV)
    1 Kings 18:19 Now therefore send, and gather to me all Israel to Mount Carmel, and four hundred fifty of the prophets of Baal, and four hundred of the prophets of the Asherah, who eat at Jezebel's table." (See RSV)
    . (See RSV)

    http://concordances.org/b/ba'al.htm


    whats your source
    It is proper to take alarm at the first experiment on our liberties. The freeman of America did not wait till usurped power had strengthened itself by exercise, and entangled the question in precedents. James Madison
    Live as free people, yet without employing your freedom as a pretext for wickedness; but live at all times as servants of God.
    1 Peter 2:16

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    Quote Originally Posted by Wind Song View Post
    Ba'al is a divine title in Hebrew. It means "master". Christians have demonized the term.
    Christians have demonized the term? Ba'al is mentioned once in the New Testament. And that is to quote a passage of the Old Testament.

    The initial videos I provided were from Rabbi Daniel Lapin. Is he Christian now?
    If we were as industrious to become good as to make ourselves great, we should become really great by being good, and the number of valuable men would be much increased; but it is a grand mistake to think of being great without goodness; and i pronounce it as certain that there was never yet a truly great man that was not at the same time truly virtuous." - Ben Franklin

    Imagine what good we can do if we all joined together, united as followers of Christ - M. Russell Ballard

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    Quote Originally Posted by avatar4321 View Post
    Christians have demonized the term? Ba'al is mentioned once in the New Testament. And that is to quote a passage of the Old Testament.

    The initial videos I provided were from Rabbi Daniel Lapin. Is he Christian now?
    Christians think of Ba'al as the devil.

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