Hellow from Russia

[Polite Russian]

You're doing fine with your English.

What kind of news do you get, and how much of it is controlled by the government? Do you get British or American news channels?

And is your internet completely uncensored?

The reason I ask is because we hear things about Russian censorship occasionally, but there's really no way of knowing unless you talk to someone in the region.

I dont get Brit and USA channels, but I get youtube

I already said, that I know some people, who is fighting there right now. They are all voluteers, and some of them dont like our government, so I believe them and their infotmation. They did not saw russian military. They saw a lot of locals, some former Ukrain soldiers. If our military there - even rebels dont know about them.

Cencore in our internet is only in some radical islam, nazi and that tipe of extremism websites.
We have our freedom of speech, if you are about that

[Drummond]

I dont get Brit and USA channels, but I get youtube

I already said, that I know some people, who is fighting there right now. They are all voluteers, and some of them dont like our government, so I believe them and their infotmation. They did not saw russian military. They saw a lot of locals, some former Ukrain soldiers. If our military there - even rebels dont know about them.

Cencore in our internet is only in some radical islam, nazi and that tipe of extremism websites.
We have our freedom of speech, if you are about that

Do you get sight of Wikipedia ? Wikipedia is a form of online encyclopaedia, perpetually updated (depending on the entry ..)

This might interest you. I hope you can open the link and confirm that what's below is accurately quoted.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2014%E2...ion_in_Ukraine

2014–15 Russian military intervention in Ukraine was openly acknowledged by the President of Russia Vladimir Putin in the 2015 documentary film Crimea. The Way Home where he explicitly states that he personally was involved in the annexation of Crimea. That fact was also confirmed by the Nemtsov report.

The first post-Euromaidan Russian military operation in Ukraine took place on the night 22–23 February 2014, when president Viktor Yanukovych was evacuated to Crimea by Russian helicopters. Starting with the 2014 Crimean crisis, soldiers of ambiguous affiliation began to take control of strategic positions and infrastructure within the Ukrainian territory of Crimea, which Russia then annexed. On 4 March, during his press conference, Putin denied Russian troops interfered but then admitted on 17 April that Russian troops had been active in Crimea and said this had laid the ground for the Crimean status referendum.

After the annexation of Crimea, demonstrations by pro-Russian groups in the Donbass area of Ukraine escalated into an armed conflict between the separatist forces of the self-declared Donetsk and Lugansk People's Republics and the Ukrainian government. In August, Russian military vehicles crossed the border in several locations of Donetsk Oblast, massing over 40,000 army units near the Ukrainian border. Russia denied it sent military personnel and equipment leading Western and Ukrainian military officials to term Russia's involvement a 'stealth invasion' The incursion by the Russian military was seen as responsible for the defeat of Ukrainian forces in early September.

In November 2014 the Ukrainian military reported intensive movement of troops and equipment from Russia into the separatist controlled parts of eastern Ukraine. The Associated Press reported 80 unmarked military vehicles on the move in rebel-controlled areas. An OSCE Special Monitoring Mission observed convoys of heavy weapons and tanks in DPR-controlled territory without insignia. According to an independent assessment provided to The Daily Beast, there were as many as 7,000 Russian troops inside Ukraine in early November 2014, with between 40,000 and 50,000 at the country’s eastern border. OSCE monitors further observed vehicles apparently used to transport soldiers' dead bodies crossing the Russian-Ukrainian border on Ukraine on 11 November 2014.

Russian soldiers captured in Ukraine, comments made by rebel leaders such as Alexander Zakharchenko, and statements from human rights groups indicated that Russian service personnel were fighting in Ukraine. Russia has denied allegations of its involvement in eastern Ukraine.

Several members of the international community and organizations such as Amnesty International have condemned Russia for its actions in post-revolutionary Ukraine, accusing it of breaking international law and violating Ukrainian sovereignty. Many countries implemented economic sanctions against Russia or Russian individuals or companies, to which Russia responded in kind. The Kremlin has tried to systematically intimidate and silence human rights workers who have raised questions about Russian soldiers' deaths in the conflict

I think that a lot of the truth has been kept from you. I hope that the above account will be helpful.

So I have a further question.

How do ordinary Russians interpret the West's sanctions against Russia .. why do THEY think those sanctions exist ?

[John V]

My take on the Ukraine.
The Ukraine is a basket case economically and so why would anyone want it. When it all started I looked at who was involved, the U.S. and European Union and why. There’s that old saying isn’t there; if Iraq had grown carrots it would never have been invaded. Anyway, then I saw Russian pipelines that flowed gas into Europe and it all started to make sense. Putin steps in, draws a red line and sends both packing. The west stamps its foot and replies with sanctions, NATO moves its forces close to the Russian border; Russia retaliates by sending its aircraft closer to the western borders . . . that’s where we are now.

Meanwhile the U.S. sends a warship to the South China seas in the islands dispute between China and Japan – and that’s not going down well here at all and it’s building up anti-American feeling. I’ve actually started to carry my English passport around with me. It’s a bit like the old Cuba thing – not in our backyard, but Russia and China today are very different from those of old, very nationalistic and both are able to back up their rhetoric with deeds as well as words. I’ve a feeling it won’t end well if all three start flexing their muscles.

[Drummond]

My take on the Ukraine.
The Ukraine is a basket case economically and so why would anyone want it. When it all started I looked at who was involved, the U.S. and European Union and why. There’s that old saying isn’t there; if Iraq had grown carrots it would never have been invaded. Anyway, then I saw Russian pipelines that flowed gas into Europe and it all started to make sense. Putin steps in, draws a red line and sends both packing. The west stamps its foot and replies with sanctions, NATO moves its forces close to the Russian border; Russia retaliates by sending its aircraft closer to the western borders . . . that’s where we are now.

Meanwhile the U.S. sends a warship to the South China seas in the islands dispute between China and Japan – and that’s not going down well here at all and it’s building up anti-American feeling. I’ve actually started to carry my English passport around with me. It’s a bit like the old Cuba thing – not in our backyard, but Russia and China today are very different from those of old, very nationalistic and both are able to back up their rhetoric with deeds as well as words. I’ve a feeling it won’t end well if all three start flexing their muscles.

My apologies, John, I'm largely ignorant of the troubles in your part of the world. I need to do some research, evidently.

As for Ukraine, and your reference to Russian gas ..

https://euobserver.com/foreign/124131

Ukraine plans to use EU and IMF money to pay for Russian gas, but will not pay a cent unless Moscow agrees a market price, its authorities say.Its caretaker PM, Arseniy Yatsenyuk, made the point at a meeting with European Commission chief Jose Manuel Barroso in Brussels on Tuesday (13 May).

He said: “We want a deal based on market conditions. If Russia rejects this, we will bring Russia to [an international arbitrage] court in Stockholm. If I’m not mistaken, there’s 20 days left - this is the final call for Russia to sit at the negotiating table.”

He noted that Russia’s ultimatum on gas debts is offset by its seizure of Ukrainian energy assets in Crimea last month, worth “tens, if not hundreds, of billions of dollars.” He listed stolen assets as: 2 billion cubic metres of gas in storage vats; two energy firms; onshore and offshore drilling facilities; and offshore gas fields.

Ukraine’s ambassador to the EU, Kostyantin Yeliseyev, told EU observer on Wednesday that no EU or International Monetary Fund (IMF) money will be used to pay Russia’s “political” gas price.

“We are not so stupid or naive as to pay this price,” he noted.

“The situation is not easy and time is running: We need to start filling our underground storage facilities so that we can ensure transit of [Russian] gas to European countries [in winter],” he added.

Russian supplier Gazprom has said it will halt deliveries to Ukraine on 2 June unless it makes a pre-payment of $1.7 billion based on a price of $485 per thousand cubic metres (tcm) - almost twice the amount charged to its EU customers.

Last year it offered Ukraine $268.5 per tcm as part of a bailout for its former leader Viktor Yanukovych.

But it cancelled the offer when he fell from power and Ukraine resumed preparations to sign a free trade pact with the EU.

For its part, the EU on Tuesday signed off a €1.6 billion macro-financial aid package to Ukraine, saying the first part, worth some €600 million, will be disbursed “soon.” The deal comes on top of an IMF bailout tranche of $3.2 billion paid out one week ago.

A commission spokesman, Simon O’Connor, noted: “It is aid for the Ukrainian budget to meet its external financing needs, which includes payments in the energy sector.”

Barroso told press alongside Yatsenyuk: “Russia, if it wants to be seen as a credible supplier cannot play political games with energy.” He added: “If Russia continues with this kind of behaviour, it will only lead to its further isolation.”

Russia continues to be seen as a belligerent in these matters.

[Gunny]

My take on the Ukraine.
The Ukraine is a basket case economically and so why would anyone want it. When it all started I looked at who was involved, the U.S. and European Union and why. There’s that old saying isn’t there; if Iraq had grown carrots it would never have been invaded. Anyway, then I saw Russian pipelines that flowed gas into Europe and it all started to make sense. Putin steps in, draws a red line and sends both packing. The west stamps its foot and replies with sanctions, NATO moves its forces close to the Russian border; Russia retaliates by sending its aircraft closer to the western borders . . . that’s where we are now.

Meanwhile the U.S. sends a warship to the South China seas in the islands dispute between China and Japan – and that’s not going down well here at all and it’s building up anti-American feeling. I’ve actually started to carry my English passport around with me. It’s a bit like the old Cuba thing – not in our backyard, but Russia and China today are very different from those of old, very nationalistic and both are able to back up their rhetoric with deeds as well as words. I’ve a feeling it won’t end well if all three start flexing their muscles.

The only thing Obama flexes is his rhetoric.

[Drummond]

yeah, I know what is Wikipedia. There are full russian section of it.

Btw, did you watch that film?
Yea, I know about his words. I just said, that people, who is fighting there and not russian soldiers, I mean volunteers, did not saw russian military.

about sanctions - prices is a bit higher now. Okay. But problems unite people.

Good to know that Wikipedia is accessible in your part of the world. (No, I didn't see the film)

However ... the Wikipedia entry I quoted from disagrees with you about the presence of Russian soldiers. More, it refers to efforts by Putin to keep that truth silenced.

You haven't answered my last point. May I press you for an answer ? Why do ordinary Russians think the sanctions are being applied ?

[Polite Russian]

Do you get sight of Wikipedia ? Wikipedia is a form of online encyclopaedia, perpetually updated (depending on the entry ..)

This might interest you. I hope you can open the link and confirm that what's below is accurately quoted.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2014%E2...ion_in_Ukraine



I think that a lot of the truth has been kept from you. I hope that the above account will be helpful.

So I have a further question.

How do ordinary Russians interpret the West's sanctions against Russia .. why do THEY think those sanctions exist ?

and I also can say that a lot of truth has been kept from YOU.
look. You give me links to the websites. But I can take information from people.
There are a lot of propaganda on both sides. We need to understand, that no one knows the "full" truth.