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    Quote Originally Posted by dmp View Post
    Except if we see ourselves as God sees us, well...he sees Christ. That was already finished years ago upon the cross and likely before. To God we aren't corrupt or vile. Nothing in our hearts or souls needs fixing because to God we are already at the end of time where everything is done. When we stop thinking of the linear time we live in, and start thinking about a timeless God, so much more makes sense. I guess it'd be akin to my kids apologizing and prostrating themselves for stuff they did when they were 3 years old. It's done. It is Finished.
    Sure there's truth to that. we are/were made clean at the cross and apon belief for all eternity.
    But I think most of us would admit that we are not everyday every moment living like Jesus Christ.
    and daily most of just probably should ask for forgiveness.

    I think one pastoral analogy i've heard makes sense.
    Remember at Jesus's last supper, He began to wash all the disciples feet. But when he got to Peter He said to Jesus that 'You'll never wash my feet'. Jesus told him if he didn't then he had no part with him. and Peter said OK then wash my hands and head too. But Jesus said that those that have had a bath were already clean but they just needed their feet washed.

    and there's are several times throughout the New testament where we are encourage to ask God forgiveness AFTER we've become believers, as well as asking each other for forgiveness. Even the Prayer the Lord gave as an example ask for forgiveness. But Again it seems to me it's not something we should wallow In like the sterotype of the old Chinese servant "i your insignificant worm of a servant." But it seems as we go along in OUR linear life we... well... Lie, cheat, steal, mistreat others etc etc and need to ask forgiveness from God and from the human wronged as well. What ever that sin, it HAS been forgiven , past tense, long ago. But we are told to confess and forsake it in our linear walk today. God sees that as part of our journey as well seems to me. It seems we need to experience the action of confession and renewed cleaning linearly going forward regularly until we see our finally renewal.
    Last edited by revelarts; 06-30-2016 at 08:56 AM.
    It is proper to take alarm at the first experiment on our liberties. The freeman of America did not wait till usurped power had strengthened itself by exercise, and entangled the question in precedents. James Madison
    Live as free people, yet without employing your freedom as a pretext for wickedness; but live at all times as servants of God.
    1 Peter 2:16

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