Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 15 of 30
  1. #1
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Location
    Arizona
    Posts
    49,013
    Thanks (Given)
    25501
    Thanks (Received)
    18957
    Likes (Given)
    10828
    Likes (Received)
    7417
    Piss Off (Given)
    86
    Piss Off (Received)
    10
    Mentioned
    206 Post(s)
    Rep Power
    21475543

    Default And Here We Go With NK?



    "The government is a child that has found their parents credit card, and spends knowing that they never have to reconcile the bill with their own money"-Shannon Churchill


  2. Thanks Gunny thanked this post
  3. #2
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Location
    The Republic of Texas
    Posts
    49,579
    Thanks (Given)
    36105
    Thanks (Received)
    27789
    Likes (Given)
    3460
    Likes (Received)
    11179
    Piss Off (Given)
    0
    Piss Off (Received)
    12
    Mentioned
    396 Post(s)
    Rep Power
    21475548

    Default

    I hate to say this, but North Korea has a point for once. The exercises DO target North Korea as the potential invader.

    Seems to me propriety might dictate postponing or cancelling the exercises for the time being. That IS an in your face. How bad do you want the deal? Might want to ratchet back a few notches on that American arrogance for the time being.
    “When bad men combine, the good must associate; else they will fall, one by one, an unpitied sacrifice in a contemptible struggle.” Edumnd Burke

  4. Thanks High_Plains_Drifter thanked this post
    Likes Kathianne, High_Plains_Drifter liked this post
  5. #3
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Location
    Arizona
    Posts
    49,013
    Thanks (Given)
    25501
    Thanks (Received)
    18957
    Likes (Given)
    10828
    Likes (Received)
    7417
    Piss Off (Given)
    86
    Piss Off (Received)
    10
    Mentioned
    206 Post(s)
    Rep Power
    21475543

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Gunny View Post
    I hate to say this, but North Korea has a point for once. The exercises DO target North Korea as the potential invader.

    Seems to me propriety might dictate postponing or cancelling the exercises for the time being. That IS an in your face. How bad do you want the deal? Might want to ratchet back a few notches on that American arrogance for the time being.
    Maybe. There's something to be said for not gaining anything untl the relationship is working.


    "The government is a child that has found their parents credit card, and spends knowing that they never have to reconcile the bill with their own money"-Shannon Churchill


  6. #4
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Location
    In my knickers
    Posts
    31,029
    Thanks (Given)
    13927
    Thanks (Received)
    15358
    Likes (Given)
    4384
    Likes (Received)
    5488
    Piss Off (Given)
    0
    Piss Off (Received)
    0
    Mentioned
    181 Post(s)
    Rep Power
    21475363

    Default

    Saving face is as we know, a very big deal for Asians. This needs to stop for the time-being.
    After the game, the king and the pawn go into the same box - Author unknown

    “Unfortunately, the truth is now whatever the media say it is”
    -Abbey

  7. Thanks High_Plains_Drifter thanked this post
  8. #5
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Location
    The Republic of Texas
    Posts
    49,579
    Thanks (Given)
    36105
    Thanks (Received)
    27789
    Likes (Given)
    3460
    Likes (Received)
    11179
    Piss Off (Given)
    0
    Piss Off (Received)
    12
    Mentioned
    396 Post(s)
    Rep Power
    21475548

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Kathianne View Post
    Maybe. There's something to be said for not gaining anything untl the relationship is working.
    A valid point. We have however held joint military exercises with South Korea since before I was in the Marine Corps. I got to go on one. What luck

    It's not going to break anybody's butt to miss one or postpone it. Like I said, how bad do you want a deal? Weigh one against the other. Denuclearization of the Korean peninsula vs another lame, repetitious military exercise that could be held any time. Trump & Co & S Korea have worked for a year and half to get where they are on this deal.

    Also, depending on what exactly is in the deal, isn't de-militarization of the peninsula part of the package? A signed deal would render the exercise pointless anyway.

    I think it can and should be postponed indefinitely pending negotiations. Just my opinion.
    “When bad men combine, the good must associate; else they will fall, one by one, an unpitied sacrifice in a contemptible struggle.” Edumnd Burke

  9. #6
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Location
    Arizona
    Posts
    49,013
    Thanks (Given)
    25501
    Thanks (Received)
    18957
    Likes (Given)
    10828
    Likes (Received)
    7417
    Piss Off (Given)
    86
    Piss Off (Received)
    10
    Mentioned
    206 Post(s)
    Rep Power
    21475543

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Gunny View Post
    A valid point. We have however held joint military exercises with South Korea since before I was in the Marine Corps. I got to go on one. What luck

    It's not going to break anybody's butt to miss one or postpone it. Like I said, how bad do you want a deal? Weigh one against the other. Denuclearization of the Korean peninsula vs another lame, repetitious military exercise that could be held any time. Trump & Co & S Korea have worked for a year and half to get where they are on this deal.

    Also, depending on what exactly is in the deal, isn't de-militarization of the peninsula part of the package? A signed deal would render the exercise pointless anyway.

    I think it can and should be postponed indefinitely pending negotiations. Just my opinion.
    He said, "No preconditions." Now threatens to pull out. Not good.


    "The government is a child that has found their parents credit card, and spends knowing that they never have to reconcile the bill with their own money"-Shannon Churchill


  10. #7
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Location
    The Republic of Texas
    Posts
    49,579
    Thanks (Given)
    36105
    Thanks (Received)
    27789
    Likes (Given)
    3460
    Likes (Received)
    11179
    Piss Off (Given)
    0
    Piss Off (Received)
    12
    Mentioned
    396 Post(s)
    Rep Power
    21475548

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Kathianne View Post
    He said, "No preconditions." Now threatens to pull out. Not good.
    Neither is practicing to kick his while claiming we want peace and stability.
    “When bad men combine, the good must associate; else they will fall, one by one, an unpitied sacrifice in a contemptible struggle.” Edumnd Burke

  11. #8
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Location
    Arizona
    Posts
    49,013
    Thanks (Given)
    25501
    Thanks (Received)
    18957
    Likes (Given)
    10828
    Likes (Received)
    7417
    Piss Off (Given)
    86
    Piss Off (Received)
    10
    Mentioned
    206 Post(s)
    Rep Power
    21475543

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Gunny View Post
    Neither is practicing to kick his while claiming we want peace and stability.
    Actually, it looks like he's playimg at something. The exercises were already underway when he did this. It's not like he didn't know beforehand.


    "The government is a child that has found their parents credit card, and spends knowing that they never have to reconcile the bill with their own money"-Shannon Churchill


  12. #9
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Location
    The Republic of Texas
    Posts
    49,579
    Thanks (Given)
    36105
    Thanks (Received)
    27789
    Likes (Given)
    3460
    Likes (Received)
    11179
    Piss Off (Given)
    0
    Piss Off (Received)
    12
    Mentioned
    396 Post(s)
    Rep Power
    21475548

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Kathianne View Post
    Actually, it looks like he's playimg at something. The exercises were already underway when he did this. It's not like he didn't know beforehand.
    I really don't know with this nutcase. That's just my opinion. They're going to do what they're going to do and so is Un, even if he doesn't know what that is from one minute to the next.

    Maybe he considers strong arming them to stop would be some power play and victory. Here's the thing with Korea. There's a holding force on the ground in South Korea. The REAL force is the Navy and island of Okinawa, home of the 3rd Marine Expeditionary Force and Kadena AFB. Most of those exercises are Navy and the Army holding force jockeying around on the ground. When we went to Team Spirit 84 from Oki, we sent a token force from 3rd Marine Division.

    There's Anderson AFB on Guam which has so many B-52s I surprised the island hasn't sank. There's an AFB in Japan. Yokosuka I believe. There's a Navy base in Japan. And those are all permanent forces, not just exercise people in for the weekend. I honestly believe Un has no idea what he is actually facing.

    So we postpone the exercise. I consider it the wiser course of action, and something we can afford from position of overwhelming strength. It's not like anyone's going to go away. It's a bit of reverse psychology. Call his bluff, but not by confronting him. Let him have enough rope to hang himself or make a deal. Either way, he outs himself. Then, if he's stooging around HE is the bad guy instead of us looking like the bullies.

    It costs us nothing, and if he balks we can always hold an exercise the next day. It's not like they don't have 3-5 of them a year anyway.
    “When bad men combine, the good must associate; else they will fall, one by one, an unpitied sacrifice in a contemptible struggle.” Edumnd Burke

  13. #10
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Location
    Arizona
    Posts
    49,013
    Thanks (Given)
    25501
    Thanks (Received)
    18957
    Likes (Given)
    10828
    Likes (Received)
    7417
    Piss Off (Given)
    86
    Piss Off (Received)
    10
    Mentioned
    206 Post(s)
    Rep Power
    21475543

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Gunny View Post
    I really don't know with this nutcase. That's just my opinion. They're going to do what they're going to do and so is Un, even if he doesn't know what that is from one minute to the next.

    Maybe he considers strong arming them to stop would be some power play and victory. Here's the thing with Korea. There's a holding force on the ground in South Korea. The REAL force is the Navy and island of Okinawa, home of the 3rd Marine Expeditionary Force and Kadena AFB. Most of those exercises are Navy and the Army holding force jockeying around on the ground. When we went to Team Spirit 84 from Oki, we sent a token force from 3rd Marine Division.

    There's Anderson AFB on Guam which has so many B-52s I surprised the island hasn't sank. There's an AFB in Japan. Yokosuka I believe. There's a Navy base in Japan. And those are all permanent forces, not just exercise people in for the weekend. I honestly believe Un has no idea what he is actually facing.

    So we postpone the exercise. I consider it the wiser course of action, and something we can afford from position of overwhelming strength. It's not like anyone's going to go away. It's a bit of reverse psychology. Call his bluff, but not by confronting him. Let him have enough rope to hang himself or make a deal. Either way, he outs himself. Then, if he's stooging around HE is the bad guy instead of us looking like the bullies.

    It costs us nothing, and if he balks we can always hold an exercise the next day. It's not like they don't have 3-5 of them a year anyway.
    I get what you're saying, but Trump isn't doing that. Seems the WH is basically ignoring his threat thus far..


    "The government is a child that has found their parents credit card, and spends knowing that they never have to reconcile the bill with their own money"-Shannon Churchill


  14. #11
    Join Date
    May 2012
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    23,251
    Thanks (Given)
    7207
    Thanks (Received)
    11746
    Likes (Given)
    1048
    Likes (Received)
    1381
    Piss Off (Given)
    4
    Piss Off (Received)
    0
    Mentioned
    39 Post(s)
    Rep Power
    21475220

    Default Now, at last. Everyone who didn't believe the President, should see...

    Little Rocket Man is just playing more games. He does have to 'save face' to some extent, and doesn't want to look like the WUSS we all know he is to those he pretends to lead. So..he had to make this threat to get attention.
    The exercises should go on, just to let the President Prove...He's Not a Pushover like Obama, Bush, and the Clinton's.

    Trump doesn't expect Rocket Man to keep his word on ANYTHING. IMO.



    I love to make Liberals Cry, and Whine.
    So, this is for them.
    GOD BLESS AMERICA - IN GOD WE TRUST !

  15. #12
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Location
    The Republic of Texas
    Posts
    49,579
    Thanks (Given)
    36105
    Thanks (Received)
    27789
    Likes (Given)
    3460
    Likes (Received)
    11179
    Piss Off (Given)
    0
    Piss Off (Received)
    12
    Mentioned
    396 Post(s)
    Rep Power
    21475548

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by aboutime View Post
    Little Rocket Man is just playing more games. He does have to 'save face' to some extent, and doesn't want to look like the WUSS we all know he is to those he pretends to lead. So..he had to make this threat to get attention.
    The exercises should go on, just to let the President Prove...He's Not a Pushover like Obama, Bush, and the Clinton's.

    Trump doesn't expect Rocket Man to keep his word on ANYTHING. IMO.



    I disagree. The President of the United States doesn't have to PROVE anything. He's the President of the United States. NOBODY, to include Un, thinks Un is any kind of an equal.

    They're going to do what they want. I posted above why I would go the other route. i don't think a dime-a-dozen military exercise is worth nt getting our hands on the idiot's nukes. Plus, Trump has already pissed off half the World twice in 2 weeks. Stick it on Un to be the bad guy. PR is killing us right now and IMO, only the canning of the Iran deal was the only one worth the price. Moving our embassy from one dirty spot to another in Israel accomplishes absolutely nothing from where I sit. Same with a military exercise when we stand a chance at solving a 70 years old wart.
    “When bad men combine, the good must associate; else they will fall, one by one, an unpitied sacrifice in a contemptible struggle.” Edumnd Burke

  16. #13
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Location
    South Wales, UK
    Posts
    11,895
    Thanks (Given)
    20722
    Thanks (Received)
    8222
    Likes (Given)
    2213
    Likes (Received)
    1128
    Piss Off (Given)
    5
    Piss Off (Received)
    0
    Mentioned
    164 Post(s)
    Rep Power
    19319423

    Default

    The current exercises were arranged some time ago, I understand ?

    And .. N Korea has to surely accept that it's acted aggressively until very recently, so it's a bit rich for them to show intolerance to other powers who also flex their military muscle. Perhaps Kim Jong-Un thinks that his is the only national power with any so-called 'right' to do so ?

    North Korea has sown distrust in it for a considerable period. They can now prove they've reformed. If they're genuine .. they'll continue to show us that they have done so.
    It's That Bloody Foreigner Again !!!

  17. #14
    Join Date
    May 2015
    Location
    Podunk, WI
    Posts
    9,836
    Thanks (Given)
    4248
    Thanks (Received)
    4521
    Likes (Given)
    4519
    Likes (Received)
    2814
    Piss Off (Given)
    0
    Piss Off (Received)
    0
    Mentioned
    38 Post(s)
    Rep Power
    0

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Gunny View Post
    I hate to say this, but North Korea has a point for once. The exercises DO target North Korea as the potential invader.

    Seems to me propriety might dictate postponing or cancelling the exercises for the time being. That IS an in your face. How bad do you want the deal? Might want to ratchet back a few notches on that American arrogance for the time being.
    After hearing about this and reading the OP's link, before I read a single comment, what you said above was exactly what I was thinking.

    Little rocket man has come a long way so far I'd say, he's quit shooting off rockets, he's meet with Pompeo already and he's planning to blow up nuke sites, etc, hell, don't push the guy right now. Why fuck up something that appears to be going good and it's historic beyond measure? Just postpone the damn exercises indefinitely. We been doing this shit with SOKO for decades, don't we have a pretty damn good idea how it go by now?

    I think it's stupid to hold those military exercises right now. I would have certainly recommended against it. It certainly doesn't seem to fit in with any "art of the deal" narrative in my opinion.
    Last edited by High_Plains_Drifter; 05-15-2018 at 10:37 PM.

  18. Thanks Gunny thanked this post
  19. #15
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Posts
    18,759
    Piss Off (Given)
    0
    Piss Off (Received)
    0
    Mentioned
    139 Post(s)
    Rep Power
    21475240

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Gunny View Post
    I hate to say this, but North Korea has a point for once. The exercises DO target North Korea as the potential invader.
    Doesn't matter at all. Any exercises going on were planned years ago - at least started planning; and they may be annual exercises anyway - and probably exercises used to evaluate readiness. They are not provocative; they are not new or sudden; they are training and training the way the Soldiers there have done it for decades. NK is just cherry picking shit to manipulate stuff. NK is like a really naggy, bitchy partner - they know only this: Passive-aggressive stammering and rolling on the floor throwing a fit until they get their way. Up until Trump most US Presidents were enabling helicopter type parents who satiated instead of corrected.

    God i'm good. I hadn't clicked the link until after replying:

    "The purpose of the training is to enhance the ROK-U.S. Allilance's ability to defend the ROK and enhance interoperability and readiness," the statement said. "While we will not discuss specifics, the defensive nature of these combined exercises has been clear for many decades and has not changed."
    mmhmm.
    “… the greatest detractor from high performance is fear: fear that you are not prepared, fear that you are in over your head, fear that you are not worthy, and ultimately, fear of failure. If you can eliminate that fear—not through arrogance or just wishing difficulties away, but through hard work and preparation—you will put yourself in an incredibly powerful position to take on the challenges you face" - Pete Carroll.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
Debate Policy - Political Forums