When are you planning to leave Manbij ?

[Farah]

Firstly ... congratulations are in order. Farah, I applaud your approach. Instead of merely posting material, you are now making efforts to enter into debate. This is what we're here for !

I have a couple of questions (granted, they don't particularly address the main subject, though I still think there's relevance in them ..).

1. You say 'You should take your soldiers away as quick as possible'. I want to get the fullest sense of why you say that. Is it a friendly piece of advice, or, is its fullest meaning that of a more intolerant spirit ? I ask because I don't get any sense from your posting that you adopt any pro-Western sympathies, to put it mildly.

2. I noted that in a previous post, you included this ... I quote verbatim:



Please explain your use of quotation marks. This comes across as a non-acceptance of the accuracy of what you're saying. Are you implying that the US should not be regarded as an ally ? More critically, perhaps ... you also seem to question (from the same level of judgment employed) a questioning of whether ISIS ever seized the region they in fact HAD seized.

It's possible to discern from all of this that you're fundamentally anti-US, and critical of reports which objectively describe ISIS's actions. From this, I must ask: do you retain sympathy, or any level of support at all, for ISIS .. ?

You were also invited to enter a debate in my first topic, but you did not, because you didnt like to face with facts.

Yes this is a friendly advice, we would not like to harm our allies. There are not only US units, there are units from different Western countries. I put it in quotes because yes we are allies on the paper but most of Turkish people (at least %60-70) does not like and even hates US govt. It is nothing different for US too, US dont likes Turkiye (and dont like many other countries) but see them as "tools" to achieve their goals. So in summary we are allies because US needs Turkiye in this region. US govt also wants to take control of their "allies" and they hate the ones they cant control, for example current Turkish govt. I put the "seize" part into question marks because most of people around ME thinks that ISIS is just a theatre and just another tool used by different countries, especially by US.

[CSM]

So, now that we have established that Farah does not like the US and has no interest in alternative points of view on her postings, I presume we can move on to bigger and better things. Clearly, nothing Farah can post here will win any friends for Turkey or recruits for ISIS from this membership.

[Gunny]

You were also invited to enter a debate in my first topic, but you did not, because you didnt like to face with facts.

Yes this is a friendly advice, we would not like to harm our allies. There are not only US units, there are units from different Western countries. I put it in quotes because yes we are allies on the paper but most of Turkish people (at least %60-70) does not like and even hates US govt. It is nothing different for US too, US dont likes Turkiye (and dont like many other countries) but see them as "tools" to achieve their goals. So in summary we are allies because US needs Turkiye in this region. US govt also wants to take control of their "allies" and they hate the ones they cant control, for example current Turkish govt. I put the "seize" part into question marks because most of people around ME dont think that ISIS is just a theatre and just another tool used by different countries, especially by US.

Present some facts. Real ones.Correction: The US "needed" (past Tense) Turkey in the region. That was before technology made you obsolete. We don't have Cold War listening posts anymore.

You give yourself too much credit. Most Americans don't know a damned thing about Turkey and could care less about the place, much less bother hating you. Turks hate the US because you had to crawl to us on your knees for protection against the Soviet Union and you just can't stand that fact. It doesn't go with your over-inflated egos.

[Farah]

Today US backed terror groups held a bomb attack to a hospital in Al-Bab town of Syria which was controlled by ISIS and seized by Turkish Army. (Which was probably planned to be seized by US backed terror groups if Turkiye would not involve) and murdered 8 years old kid. You wont hear such kind of news in your "free" country.

[Farah]

Today, another bomb attack done to Cobanbey town of Syria by US backed terror groups, wounds 6 people. Why US backed groups are attacking these regions ? Because these regions were the part of their imaginary illegal country and they gets mad beucase they could not invade these towns under the pretext of "figthing" ISIS.

[CSM]

Today US backed terror groups held a bomb attack to a hospital in Al-Bab town of Syria which was controlled by ISIS and seized by Turkish Army. (Which was probably planned to be seized by US backed terror groups if Turkiye would not involve) and murdered 8 years old kid. You wont hear such kind of news in your "free" country.

Oh we hear about it ... along with reams of other propaganda being spewed by ISIS sympathizers. While we are at it, lets mention the 40,000 people slaughtered by the Turkish government since 1984 or the 1600 human rights violations committed by the Turks (according to the UN) and the 80+ journalists locked up by that same government (so much for YOUR "freedom").


Works both ways Farah...

[Drummond]

You were also invited to enter a debate in my first topic, but you did not, because you didnt like to face with facts.

Yes this is a friendly advice, we would not like to harm our allies. There are not only US units, there are units from different Western countries. I put it in quotes because yes we are allies on the paper but most of Turkish people (at least %60-70) does not like and even hates US govt. It is nothing different for US too, US dont likes Turkiye (and dont like many other countries) but see them as "tools" to achieve their goals. So in summary we are allies because US needs Turkiye in this region. US govt also wants to take control of their "allies" and they hate the ones they cant control, for example current Turkish govt. I put the "seize" part into question marks because most of people around ME thinks that ISIS is just a theatre and just another tool used by different countries, especially by US.

I saw no invitation for debate in the thread containing your 'first topic'. All you did was offer us material ... minus additional debate from yourself.

This is why your current contribution invites greater welcome ... NOW, you're debating with us.

You say that 60-70 percent of the Turkish people hate the US Government. Why ? Is it personal dislike of just the current Government, or are they hated just for being American, and daring to have a world presence which best befits both their power and values ?

Your claim that the US dislikes Turkey and most other countries is surely ludicrous. I must make clear, if you're not already aware of it, that I'm not American myself, but British. Nonetheless, I state with confidence that your assertion is ludicrous ... I believe that most Americans are too busy with other issues, not least their own domestic ones, to retain much knowledge of Turkey, much less consciously decide to 'hate' that country.

For your part, to what extent is that true in reverse, and how much of this 'hatred' of America from your side of things comes from ill-informed propaganda sources ? I invite your honest response to that question, Farah ...

I think it's from that ill-informed basis that you also presume the US wishes to 'control' its allies. I say .. 'NONSENSE' to that charge. The US is a world leader in advocating the value of freedom ... it's core to what the American people believe in.

And I can speak as a citizen of a 'US ally' nation myself. I assure you, the US definitely does NOT 'control' us !!! [If any power is a far better candidate for that of a 'control freak' entity ... it's the European Union .....].

[Gunny]

Today US backed terror groups held a bomb attack to a hospital in Al-Bab town of Syria which was controlled by ISIS and seized by Turkish Army. (Which was probably planned to be seized by US backed terror groups if Turkiye would not involve) and murdered 8 years old kid. You wont hear such kind of news in your "free" country.

Today, another bomb attack done to Cobanbey town of Syria by US backed terror groups, wounds 6 people. Why US backed groups are attacking these regions ? Because these regions were the part of their imaginary illegal country and they gets mad beucase they could not invade these towns under the pretext of "figthing" ISIS.

I want to thank you, Turk. Thanks for proving EVERYTHING I have posted about Turks and Turkey whenever the topic has come up. You indeed are everything i have ever stated and more.

You couldn't have done a better job

[Farah]

Oh we hear about it ... along with reams of other propaganda being spewed by ISIS sympathizers. While we are at it, lets mention the 40,000 people slaughtered by the Turkish government since 1984 or the 1600 human rights violations committed by the Turks (according to the UN) and the 80+ journalists locked up by that same government (so much for YOUR "freedom").


Works both ways Farah...

So again are you trying to justify a crime by falsely blaming someone else with the same crime as you did in my first topic ? This does not make you innocent. If what you mean by "40.000" is terror organization members, this is what happens if you are a terrorist. They are also recognized as terrorists by US govt. Seem like you are not even aware of your own govt.

Having a journalist ID card does not make you someone untouchabled, if you violate the laws you will be punished. This is another issue that Western people are heavily brainwashed by their govt and govt controlled media. Most of these so called "journalists" has direct ties with terror organizations. Actually these fake personal images like "journalist" or "prolector in an Universty" or "Christian priest or imam" or "charity workers" are just popular covers for terrorists. On the other hand, there are not 80 journalist in Turkiye, there are 14.000 journalist in Turkiye who has media ID cards. You can accept these 80 people as "Julian Assange" or "Snowden" of Turkiye, when we ignore Assange and Snowden are much more innocent then the ones we have.

[Gunny]

https://www.trtworld.com/middle-east...flare-up-21612

Stop attacking Gaza – Turkey tells Israel
On Tuesday, Turkey called for end to "Israel's unlawful, tyranny and occupying attitude" in Gaza.
"Israel should stop these attacks immediately against the people of Gaza,” Turkey's presidential spokesperson Ibrahim Kalin said in a statement.
"The world should say 'stop' to the invading and expansionist policies of Israel which aims to to turn Palestinian land into an open air prison besides the provocative action of changing the status of Jerusalem. Turkey will continue to support the rightful cause of the Palestinian people."

Some morning hypocrisy.

[Farah]

Okay lets back to the main subject.


In the region where Turkiye is going to start an operation, there are ;

- 4000 US soldiers
- 300 France soldiers
- 100 British soldiers
- 50 Italian soldiers
- 60.000 PKK terrorists
- 26 US military bases
- 1 France military base

[CSM]

So again are you trying to justify a crime by falsely blaming someone else with the same crime as you did in my first topic ? This does not make you innocent. If what you mean by "40.000" is terror organization members, this is what happens if you are a terrorist. They are also recognized as terrorists by US govt. Seem like you are not even aware of your own govt.

Having a journalist ID card does not make you someone untouchabled, if you violate the laws you will be punished. This is another issue that Western people are heavily brainwashed by their govt and govt controlled media. Most of these so called "journalists" has direct ties with terror organizations. Actually these fake personal images like "journalist" or "prolector in an Universty" or "Christian priest or imam" or "charity workers" are just popular covers for terrorists. On the other hand, there are not 80 journalist in Turkiye, there are 14.000 journalist in Turkiye who has media ID cards. You can accept these 80 people as "Julian Assange" or "Snowden" of Turkiye, when we ignore Assange and Snowden are much more innocent then the ones we have.

Again? I wasn't aware that I had justified any crimes before this ...

It appears that anyone you don't like is labelled a "terrorist" and thus justified in any action you and your backward country care to take against them to include torture and murder. I don't now where you think you get your moral superiority from but I am willing to bet it comes out of some Muslim writing someplace. By the way, I did not say there were 80 journalists in Turkey... I said there were 80 journalists in jail in Turkey....huge difference to the intelligent but probably not to one such as yourself.

[CSM]

Okay lets back to the main subject.


In the region where Turkiye is going to start an operation, there are ;

- 4000 US soldiers
- 300 France soldiers
- 100 British soldiers
- 50 Italian soldiers
- 60.000 PKK terrorists
- 26 US military bases
- 1 France military base

You Turks better get some reinforcements then.

[Farah]

Again? I wasn't aware that I had justified any crimes before this ...

It appears that anyone you don't like is labelled a "terrorist" and thus justified in any action you and your backward country care to take against them to include torture and murder. I don't now where you think you get your moral superiority from but I am willing to bet it comes out of some Muslim writing someplace. By the way, I did not say there were 80 journalists in Turkey... I said there were 80 journalists in jail in Turkey....huge difference to the intelligent but probably not to one such as yourself.

ISIS is also a terror organization and had about 30.000-40.000 members and did it only in 5-6 years. Having soo much members does not justify someones criminal actions, again you are trying to justify terrorism with false propositions. I meant stop acting like there are only 80 journalists. There are many foreign news agencies operating in Turkiye, there are many news agencies that wasting all their time the attack Turkish govt since years. As I said Western people are heavily brainwashed.

[CSM]

ISIS is also a terror organization and had about 30.000-40.000 members and did it only in 5-6 years. Having soo much members does not justify someones criminal actions, again you are trying to justify terrorism with false propositions. I meant stop acting like there are only 80 journalists. There are many foreign news agencies operating in Turkiye, there are many news agencies that wasting all their time the attack Turkish govt since years. As I said Western people are heavily brainwashed.

I just have to ask... if you are so convinced that all westerners are so brainwashed... why are you bothering to post here?

I do find your misconceptions and uneducated opinions rather amusing however.