"How Much Can You Bench?" vs Weight Training

[Gunny]

I was Googling for an old army buddy last week, we went to a school together at Ft. Sam in 1988. He was really into lifting and we'd lift together. He started taking steroids he got from Mexico. He got 'roid rage and beat his wife. I found out the other day he passed away in 1995, I don't know what from, but I wouldn't doubt if it was due to those steroids. So never do that stuff is all I can say.

I lift weights every other day at our HOA gym, I do some warm-ups, then standing military press two barbells (total weight); 90, 100, 80, 100, 90, 100 x 5 reps. Then I do 3 sets of 120, usually 2/3/2 reps. I also use the Nautilus machines, the bench machine goes up to 200, I do that for a few reps and sets, and some of the other machines. I've lost 60 pounds the past 5-6 months.

I've got a bad back and was on the floor stretching, this guy kept stepping over me and being rude, brushing on me. I asked him to stop and he got all mouthy and in my face. He was much younger, a bit shorter, but a lot wider. He was telling me I was old and laughing at me lifting, I said if he didn't knock it off, he was going to find out how old I was. So I was stretching again, he walked past and kicked me, called me a pussy and said he was going to kick my ass. So I jumped up and kicked him in the ass (my toe was bruised for a week), then I threw him out the door and said, "I'm 57 years old!"

He started crying and said he was going to call security, I said great, call the sheriff while you're at it. I spoke to security, they looked at the camera footage and saw he was targeting me, he was only walking over by me when I was on the floor stretching, at other times he was going around the mat area to the other side of the gym. They may have banned him, I don't know, haven't seen him since. Someone said he plays pro hockey, a defender; he must be a second stringer.

I would suggest if you have a bad back to lay off the standing overhead presses with dumbells. Puts a lot of compression on the spine. The more weight you use usually means more arch which means means unaligned (spinal column) compression. Dumbells being harder to control than a barbell can also cause leaning side to side which is also unaligned compression.

Since you say you have Nautilus machines (still make those, huh?) I would suggest using the pverhead press on it to alleviate some of the lower back strain.

Just my opinion

[Hot Dogger]

I would suggest if you have a bad back to lay off the standing overhead presses with dumbells. Puts a lot of compression on the spine. The more weight you use usually means more arch which means means unaligned (spinal column) compression. Dumbells being harder to control than a barbell can also cause leaning side to side which is also unaligned compression.

Since you say you have Nautilus machines (still make those, huh?) I would suggest using the overhead press on it to alleviate some of the lower back strain.

Just my opinion

Nautilus is still in business, they also make stair climbers and brands like Schwinn Fitness. The overhead press is one machine the gym doesn't have. I could do a seated or inclined overhead press, but I like standing and moving. And my back is getting better, the stress of it, as long as the disks are in place, so I do back stretches and yoga between sets. Stress achieves growth and life is growth, so says Nietzsche and me. Your opinion is valuable to me, Gunny, but I've been coddling myself too long, living la dolce vita.

The past 5-6 months, I've had little to no breads and grains, maybe a plate of pasta, maybe five potato chips, I'd a mini pretzel with dip yesterday, very little alcohol. I do eat too much cheese. As for the dumbells, the 80 and 90 is light at this point, 100 is still a bear. The 120 is a challenge but it feels lighter each time. I hope by this time next year to be at 150. They've no dumbells between 60 and 75, so I may buy a pair of 65 and 70 for them. By this time next year, I hope to weigh 205 and be doing butterfly laps in the HOA's indoor pool; although I've been doing little cardio, I want to build my muscles first.

I too was never one for that "how much do you bench" stuff, since bench pressing alone isn't a good measure of fitness, let alone fighting strength. A person can lift all the weights in the world, but then go chop wood, they find out quickly what real fitness is, so I sometimes hack at dead fall out back. I also have a big pile of septic stones in the driveway that I move around, shovel into a wheelbarrow and move to the other side of the driveway; my neighbors must think I'm crazy (I am), and it might explain why I don't get invited to neighborhood parties any more.

[Gunny]

I would suggest, keeping in mind the bad back, not doing overhead presses seated. It puts weight directly onto the spine and compresses it into your tail bone which is worse than standing. The legs, hips and arch of the back provide a buffer against this standing.

Seated incline bench presses on an incline bench would be better than any of the aforementioned overhead presses insofar as protecting the back is concerned as it minimizes the lower back involvement in the movement. The stress is placed mostly on the pectoralis minor and front deltoid.

[High_Plains_Drifter]

Bench press... yaaa... kinda hard when only a tiny portion of your triceps on one arm works... but believe it or not, I'm increasing it. I will NOT give up. That's just not an option.

I've found that the bench press bars on my gym will adjust all the way up over my head, so I can stand forward or backwards facing the gym and stand doing presses. But when I do that my good arm can, not trying, but can do more work than my atrophied triceps arm, so I use the cables. That way the right arm HAS to do it's share. I've increased what I can press with the cables by 40 lbs so far. I've been seeing and feeling good results lately since I've been pushing it. I don't just do reps anymore. I burn out my muscles with as heavy as I can lift. Read that's the way for guys my age to increase muscle mass so, getting good results. Sometimes it even hurts but, I don't quit. I do it anyway. In my head I'm screaming... "DO IT." Finally getting some increase in size, and the stronger I feel, the harder I push it.

But back in the day when I started lifting in the base gyms, most I ever benched was 275, back before crushed nerves.

And even though I've already worked out today, as I do every day, this thread is making me want to work again... it just FEELS GOOD to get PUMPED UP...

[Gunny]

My biggest "thing" when I started this thread is the amount of gimmicks. I watched Paul Anderson in the 50-something Olympics and these guys today couldn't compete. The 50s guys walk up, yank the weight off the ground to their shoulders with more power than technique, and they press it overhead. The squat-clean and press is technique. Yes, you have to be strong but not like the former group.

The former group also had weights that looked like they just bought them at Dick's Sporting Goods. Just steel.

Nowadays, those plates are some ceramic composite and the inner rings are milled. The bar inside rolls on a milled cam. This increases the speed of the spin of the weight. I am sure there is a momentum advantage to the spinning but being the garage kinda guy I am mine just go clang

The amount of weight they lift is unreal. Watching them, you know they're strong, but it's more like a technical proficiency than it is ripping the bar off the floor and slinging the weight up.

They also get to drop the bar at the top. Once the lift up is complete, they let go and step back. That's HALF the lift in MY book. I have to bring the damned thing back to the rack/floor. I couldn't afford the bars and weights and whatever they landed on if I did that crap.

[High_Plains_Drifter]

My biggest "thing" when I started this thread is the amount of gimmicks. I watched Paul Anderson in the 50-something Olympics and these guys today couldn't compete. The 50s guys walk up, yank the weight off the ground to their shoulders with more power than technique, and they press it overhead. The squat-clean and press is technique. Yes, you have to be strong but not like the former group.

The former group also had weights that looked like they just bought them at Dick's Sporting Goods. Just steel.

Nowadays, those plates are some ceramic composite and the inner rings are milled. The bar inside rolls on a milled cam. This increases the speed of the spin of the weight. I am sure there is a momentum advantage to the spinning but being the garage kinda guy I am mine just go clang

The amount of weight they lift is unreal. Watching them, you know they're strong, but it's more like a technical proficiency than it is ripping the bar off the floor and slinging the weight up.

They also get to drop the bar at the top. Once the lift up is complete, they let go and step back. That's HALF the lift in MY book. I have to bring the damned thing back to the rack/floor. I couldn't afford the bars and weights and whatever they landed on if I did that crap.

That's the truth, Gunny... these guys train to do ONE THING... CLEAN AND JERK. Well, that's not body building in my opinion. It's a competition to see who can dead lift the most weight.

If that's what you want to do, then go for it. I know it's even an olympic competition. But it's not for me. I gotta get the whole work out when I do it, from top to bottom. From the muscles in my neck to the muscles in my calves, they ALL get worked out.

I don't think it's really a good example of how strong a person is either. So they've perfected and built themselves up to be able to clean and jerk a ton of weight... ok... have at it.

[Gunny]

That's the truth, Gunny... these guys train to do ONE THING... CLEAN AND JERK. Well, that's not body building in my opinion. It's a competition to see who can dead lift the most weight.

If that's what you want to do, then go for it. I know it's even an olympic competition. But it's not for me. I gotta get the whole work out when I do it, from top to bottom. From the muscles in my neck to the muscles in my calves, they ALL get worked out.

I don't think it's really a good example of how strong a person is either. So they've perfected and built themselves up to be able to clean and jerk a ton of weight... ok... have at it.

Couple of misconceptions in your response:

At no point did I say anything bad about Olympic weightlifting. That would make me pretty dumb since that is basically what I do I was just doing the usual, "these young kids today ..." old school die hard way They STILL move some weight.

At no point have you ever seen me refer to myself as anything but a weightlifter (accepted for Olympic weightlifter). Yes, I do a few other things but the ground floor is the squat-clean and press for me. I don't do the squat snatch because it is quite frankly too painful for what it's worth and has a detrimental affect on my other lifts.

The squat-clean and press requires every muscle in your body and they ALL have to be strong enough. If you don't have a solid base from ass to neck and ass to head, you aren't putting any damned thing over your head. It is THE accepted indicator of actual power and strength. Even the NFL uses the power clean as an indicator for speed and strength.

The "competition" in weightlifting is not some other schmoe. Sure, they have contests and crap but you got the enemy all wrong. The bar is your enemy. The bar (and weights on it) is what you are trying to beat. You don't beat anybody until you beat that bar. The lifters are actually supportive of one another's lifts, win, lose or draw. In other words they're good sports.

Same pretty-much with powerlifters except they are more aggressive and always having contests and crap, BUT it is most times good natured crap.

Bodybuilders? Forget it. Narcissists in the extreme. Always trying to mind*screw* each other. Hate their competition and wish them ill (this is at the pro level ). In everyday gyms they're clique-ish. Think their clique owns the place. Rude. Heaven forbid one has name recognition.

On the other hand, most at home "boybuilders" are just doing their own thing. Building their bodies. Their goal is completely different that the other two. They want to look a certain way. It's not about the amount of weight at all. It's what each weight does for appearance.

Straight up, I started the actual Olympic-style lifting with the goal in mind of a person who woke up in the hospital and couldn't walk. I used to be a great "bench presser". Now, I'm building the core from the bottom up. You don't EVER want to not be able to walk. It'll rearrange your viewpoint, that's for sure

[Hot Dogger]

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