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  1. #1
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    Default Obama proposes massive new "civilian national security force"

    If the things this man has already said about expanding the U.S. government beyond all bounds, don't send chills down your spine, here's something that will.

    "We cannot continue to rely only on our military in order to achieve the national security objectives that we've set," [Obama] said Wednesday. "We've got to have a civilian national security force that's just as powerful, just as strong, just as well-funded."

    I know there's no point in asking a liberal such as Obama where he finds authority in the Constitution for the things he wants to do. But his belief that only government can do the things he thinks are"good" for the country, has roots far outside anything envisioned by the Founding Fathers.

    They intended that the people do pretty much everything, except for functions that obviously must be done by government (running the military, coining money, foreign relations, prosecution of criminals etc.). We've gone far beyond the limits they set out in the last century or so. But this would be a colossal jump that would surpass even the New Deal, both in its lack of constitutionality and in its potential for abuse and oppression.

    Perhaps Obama can call his new civilian security force something like the "Kinder, Gentler Brotherhood". Such a title would simultaneously reflect the good intentions he doubtlessly has for it; and its acronym would reflect the history of other organizations that were probably started for those same benevolent purposes.

    Oh, what a brave new world, that has such people in it!

    ----------------------------------------------

    http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/c...,5754842.story

    Is U.S. ready to serve?
    Experts: Bipartisan support, societal woes could aid Obama's attempt to boost volunteerism

    by John McCormick | Chicago Tribune reporter
    July 3, 2008

    From Franklin D. Roosevelt and John F. Kennedy to Bill Clinton and George W. Bush, presidents and those who aspire to be president have long put forth calls for greater public service. Some found success, while others fell short of their lofty rhetoric.

    Roosevelt formed the Civilian Conservation Corps and Kennedy created the Peace Corps with strong support and participation, while Clinton's AmeriCorps has never fully realized its potential, hampered by continuing funding struggles since its 1994 inception.

    Still, as Sen. Barack Obama called for greater public service Wednesday, some experts predict the potential now exists for programs seeking an expansion of volunteerism to succeed, despite a slumping economy and the nation being at war.

    "This may be a moment in time that is different from when earlier calls did not prove that effective," said Stephen Goldsmith, a former Indianapolis mayor and chairman of the Corporation for National and Community Service.

    Obama hopes to expand U.S. service programs: GRAPHIC Goldsmith, a Republican and professor at Harvard's Kennedy School of Government, said bipartisan support, serious societal problems and heightened interest in service among young people could offer new or expanded service programs the ability for growth not seen in decades

    He said surveys show today's youth, a group sometimes called the " 9/11 generation," is deeply attracted to service, even as such interest has fallen off for other age groups following the attacks in 2001.

    "It may represent a real shift to interest in community service," Goldsmith said.

    Amid that environment, Obama outlined several proposals to boost service, both at home and abroad, during a speech in Colorado Springs.

    "Loving your country shouldn't just mean watching fireworks on the 4th of July," Obama said. "Loving your country must mean accepting your responsibility to do your part to change it. If you do, your life will be richer, our country will be stronger."

    In his speech at a University of Colorado campus, he pledged that enhanced public service and active citizenship would be a central cause of his presidency.

    "We will ask Americans to serve," the Illinois Democrat said. "We will create new opportunities for Americans to serve."

    Obama's draw to youth
    For supporters, Obama's credibility on the topic is enhanced because he proved during the primary campaign that he could captivate and then mobilize young voters. His campaign argues they might also follow him into community service.

    Clinton had a similar, though not quite as powerful, pull among youth. But his AmeriCorps program, which recruits workers in exchange for an education stipend, has never caught on the way the Peace Corps did in the 1960s and '70s.

    Funding for AmeriCorps has been strained amid agency mismanagement and disdain for the program among some Republicans.

    Still, it recorded its 500,000th participant last year. Volunteers nationwide have served needy communities by tutoring children, feeding the homeless, caring for the elderly and rebuilding areas struck by disaster.

    Obama promised to increase AmeriCorps slots from 75,000 to 250,000 and pledged to double the size of the Peace Corps by 2011.

    Presumptive GOP nominee John McCain of Arizona also supports an expansion of both programs and has stressed public service, including in the military, during campaign appearances.

    Obama repeated his pledge to boost the size of the active military. But he said the nation's future and safety depends on more than just additional service members.

    "It also depends on the teacher in East L.A., or the nurse in Appalachia, the after-school worker in New Orleans, the Peace Corps volunteer in Africa, the Foreign Service officer in Indonesia," he said.

    Obama had outlined many of the proposals offered Wednesday during appearances in Iowa last December.

    Goals set for students
    "We cannot continue to rely only on our military in order to achieve the national security objectives that we've set," he said Wednesday. "We've got to have a civilian national security force that's just as powerful, just as strong, just as well-funded."

    He said he would make federal assistance conditional on school districts establishing service programs and set the goal of 50 hours of service a year for middle school and high school students.

    For college students, Obama would set the goal at 100 hours of service a year and create a $4,000 annual tax credit for college students tied to that level of service.
    "The social contract exists so that everyone doesn’t have to squat in the dust holding a spear to protect his woman and his meat all day every day. It does not exist so that the government can take your spear, your meat, and your woman because it knows better what to do with them." - Instapundit.com

  2. #2
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    He said he would make federal assistance conditional on school districts establishing service programs and set the goal of 50 hours of service a year for middle school and high school students.
    The dems never ending whining about the disenfranchisement of the poor and underprivileged and yet he's getting a pass for this drivel??

    How are low income people supposed to ferry around their children to after school volunteer programs?? If they don't he's going to take away some of their funding???? Or, do they get a pass and everyone else still has to do it, will it be based on income??????

    I've got 2 kids in middle school and high school, next year I'll have 3 that's 150 volunteer hours for me to drive (at $4 a gallon).

    Why would anyone vote for this idiot??

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    Can't make the poor get a drivers license to prove who they are in order to vote.

    But lets make them ferry their kids all over for volunteer work.

    Obama might want to lay off the sauce.

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    Yeah, I guess I was out of line complaining about a huge new Federal government "force", as Obama described it, whose goal was to achieve "national security", and which was to be as large and powerful as the U.S. Armed Forces themselves... and as well-funded, of course, according to Sen. Obama.. Naw, such a huge force shouldn't be any problem to the rest of us.

    But having to drive our kids to an extra program or two after school? Now THAT PISSES ME OFF!!!

    Thanx for helping me set my priorities straight, trigg.
    "The social contract exists so that everyone doesn’t have to squat in the dust holding a spear to protect his woman and his meat all day every day. It does not exist so that the government can take your spear, your meat, and your woman because it knows better what to do with them." - Instapundit.com

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    Quote Originally Posted by Little-Acorn View Post
    Yeah, I guess I was out of line complaining about a huge new Federal government "force", as Obama described it, whose goal was to achieve "national security", and which was to be as large and powerful as the U.S. Armed Forces themselves... and as well-funded, of course, according to Sen. Obama.. Naw, such a huge force shouldn't be any problem to the rest of us.

    But having to drive our kids to an extra program or two after school? Now THAT PISSES ME OFF!!!

    Thanx for helping me set my priorities straight, trigg.
    Well my point was the gov. funding being taken away and the dems fascination with the poor being disenfranchised.

    Don't let me stop your sarcasm though, have at it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Little-Acorn View Post
    Yeah, I guess I was out of line complaining about a huge new Federal government "force", as Obama described it, whose goal was to achieve "national security", and which was to be as large and powerful as the U.S. Armed Forces themselves... and as well-funded, of course, according to Sen. Obama.. Naw, such a huge force shouldn't be any problem to the rest of us.

    But having to drive our kids to an extra program or two after school? Now THAT PISSES ME OFF!!!

    Thanx for helping me set my priorities straight, trigg.
    I think you missed the point she was trying to make.... So the question is "who pissed in your cheerios this morning"? I have to agree with her on the parents haveing to foot the bill for all of this "volunteer" work. It basicly amounts to another tax on the people who can pay it.

    I don't think the "national security" should be placed in the hands of unorganized, undertrained, and questionable people.

    All this is, is another program that you and I have to pay for to give some moron a job to do.....
    Experience is what you get when you don't get what you want." -Dr. Randy Pausch


    Death is lighter than a feather, Duty is heavier than a mountain

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    "Loving your country shouldn't just mean watching fireworks on the 4th of July," Obama said. "Loving your country must mean accepting your responsibility to do your part to change it. If you do, your life will be richer, our country will be stronger."
    In an ealier thread it asked what is meant when Obama speaks of change. The only answer offerred was it meant the USA pulls out of Iraq.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Little-Acorn View Post
    I know there's no point in asking a liberal such as Obama where he finds authority in the Constitution for the things he wants to do.
    It will be the answer that is always given. The general welfare clause. Liberals will justify anything socialist because of the general welfare clause.

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    "We cannot continue to rely only on our military in order to achieve the national security objectives that we've set," [Obama] said Wednesday. "We've got to have a civilian national security force that's just as powerful, just as strong, just as well-funded."
    i would like to know what this means that they would be doing personally. Are they gonna just help and be watch dogs? are they gonna be like some sort of National Gaurd that is sup'd up?

    and i can understand the gas POV. if they kids aren't in College or under a certain age, he should make it that they get that 'tax rebate' for gas money as long as they can prove they were driving their kids around for that reason. which of course, like everything will start to be abused and cheated.
    Does Monkeybone have to choke a bitch?
    "Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote!" —Benjamin Franklin, 1759

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    Quote Originally Posted by Obama View Post
    ....."We cannot continue to rely only on our military in order to achieve the national security objectives that we've set," [Obama] said Wednesday. "We've got to have a civilian national security force that's just as powerful, just as strong, just as well-funded.".....

    Is he going to fund the Minutemen?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Monkeybone View Post
    i would like to know what this means that they would be doing personally. Are they gonna just help and be watch dogs? are they gonna be like some sort of National Gaurd that is sup'd up?

    and i can understand the gas POV. if they kids aren't in College or under a certain age, he should make it that they get that 'tax rebate' for gas money as long as they can prove they were driving their kids around for that reason. which of course, like everything will start to be abused and cheated.

    It won't come to anything. All demagogue types try this on: Bush did too, remember? After 9/11 he talked about organizing a new CCC, a sort of required draft for young people to do volunteer work in this country.

    The idea soon vanished entirely, and so will Obama's nonsense.



    But note that it IS a form of totalitarianism: the government organizing your time and your life.

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    What exactly is the point of this group? What type of National security issues cant be handled by the military?
    If we were as industrious to become good as to make ourselves great, we should become really great by being good, and the number of valuable men would be much increased; but it is a grand mistake to think of being great without goodness; and i pronounce it as certain that there was never yet a truly great man that was not at the same time truly virtuous." - Ben Franklin

    Imagine what good we can do if we all joined together, united as followers of Christ - M. Russell Ballard

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    Didn't a certain "socialist" party back in the 1930's start something much like this? If I remember right it was a way to bring pride back into the country and keep a close eye on your neighbors, you know you don't want them using too much water or electricity......
    Experience is what you get when you don't get what you want." -Dr. Randy Pausch


    Death is lighter than a feather, Duty is heavier than a mountain

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    Quote Originally Posted by avatar4321 View Post
    What exactly is the point of this group? What type of National security issues cant be handled by the military?

    All too plainly, nearly all of them!!

    The military obviously has not managed to handle either of the wars we are in; maybe Obama wants a draft so he can send troops to fight for this and that and the other black tribe in Africa. That would not make sense re our national interests, but then, neither do the two current useless wars we are losing, and a Republican started both of them.

    He could use civilians to guard the southern border of the country: neither the military NOR the border patrol has managed to secure it yet.

    There are a lot of national security issues in our cities --- Baltimore is the current murder capitol of America, but other black cities such as Detroit and Newark and Philadelphia are not far behind. Uniformed police haven't managed to keep the peace anywhere in these black cities, so maybe he'll send in battalions of young white men and women forced from their normal lives to battle drug dealers on North Avenue in Baltimore?

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    Quote Originally Posted by mundame View Post
    All too plainly, nearly all of them!!

    The military obviously has not managed to handle either of the wars we are in; maybe Obama wants a draft so he can send troops to fight for this and that and the other black tribe in Africa. That would not make sense re our national interests, but then, neither do the two current useless wars we are losing, and a Republican started both of them.

    He could use civilians to guard the southern border of the country: neither the military NOR the border patrol has managed to secure it yet.

    There are a lot of national security issues in our cities --- Baltimore is the current murder capitol of America, but other black cities such as Detroit and Newark and Philadelphia are not far behind. Uniformed police haven't managed to keep the peace anywhere in these black cities, so maybe he'll send in battalions of young white men and women forced from their normal lives to battle drug dealers on North Avenue in Baltimore?
    I dont think they are talking draft here. This sounds more like Gestapo to me.
    If we were as industrious to become good as to make ourselves great, we should become really great by being good, and the number of valuable men would be much increased; but it is a grand mistake to think of being great without goodness; and i pronounce it as certain that there was never yet a truly great man that was not at the same time truly virtuous." - Ben Franklin

    Imagine what good we can do if we all joined together, united as followers of Christ - M. Russell Ballard

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